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Paul
September 18th 04, 05:11 PM
Hello. This is my first time in this NG. I'm hoping the collective
experience in this NG can point me towards a good book on diet for
bodybuilding. I know there are tons of books and mags that discuss
this, so I'm hoping there is one or two that seems to cover all or
most of what's important and ACCURATE.

I used to lift weights in my late teens and early twenties. I'm short
(5'7"). Back then, I just ate alot of proteins (meats and shakes) and
pastas. I managed to bulk up to 160 lbs and was fairly strong for my
size. Now I'm 39, and just picked up the weights again after 15 years
off. I started at 142 lbs bodyweight. The guy at the gym sold me
creatine in tablet form and said that I should increase my calorie
intake to gain muscle. I have done this for nearly 4 weeks now and now
weigh 150 lbs.

But my body at 39 is very different than it was at 24. I have alot
more surface fat obscuring my muscles, and alot more fat around the
middle. So, at this age, I obviously need to modify my diet to lose
fat while building muscle. Hence my request in this post.

My basic questions are: (1) how, when, what, do I eat to decrease fat
and increase muscle AT THE SAME TIME, (2) should and how do I mix
cardio with weight lifting such that I don't canibalize muscle to burn
fat, and (3) what supplementation is recommended for my goals (e.g.,
creatine, protein shakes, fat burners, etc).

I'm hoping I can find a book or two that can provide accurate and
complete answers to these questions, and make me more knowledgable
about diet and lifestyle in general.

Thanks to all for listening.

Paul

Hugh Beyer
September 18th 04, 09:48 PM
(Paul) wrote in
m:

> Hello. This is my first time in this NG. I'm hoping the collective
> experience in this NG can point me towards a good book on diet for
> bodybuilding. I know there are tons of books and mags that discuss
> this, so I'm hoping there is one or two that seems to cover all or
> most of what's important and ACCURATE.
>
> I used to lift weights in my late teens and early twenties. I'm short
> (5'7"). Back then, I just ate alot of proteins (meats and shakes) and
> pastas. I managed to bulk up to 160 lbs and was fairly strong for my
> size. Now I'm 39, and just picked up the weights again after 15 years
> off. I started at 142 lbs bodyweight. The guy at the gym sold me
> creatine in tablet form and said that I should increase my calorie
> intake to gain muscle. I have done this for nearly 4 weeks now and now
> weigh 150 lbs.
>
> But my body at 39 is very different than it was at 24. I have alot
> more surface fat obscuring my muscles, and alot more fat around the
> middle. So, at this age, I obviously need to modify my diet to lose
> fat while building muscle. Hence my request in this post.
>
> My basic questions are: (1) how, when, what, do I eat to decrease fat
> and increase muscle AT THE SAME TIME, (2) should and how do I mix
> cardio with weight lifting such that I don't canibalize muscle to burn
> fat, and (3) what supplementation is recommended for my goals (e.g.,
> creatine, protein shakes, fat burners, etc).
>
> I'm hoping I can find a book or two that can provide accurate and
> complete answers to these questions, and make me more knowledgable
> about diet and lifestyle in general.
>
> Thanks to all for listening.

I'll give you something free, and with better info too.

www.bodyrecomposition.com, follow the articles link, start at the top and
read down. Lyle posts here a lot (the Queen Elizabeth is big. The Sahara's
a desert.) and hosts forums at that site. He'll answer questions if he
feels like it.

Hugh


--
One puppy had its dewclaws removed in the creation of this post, but for
reasons of hygene and it really doesn't hurt them at all.

Bob MacWilliam
September 20th 04, 12:42 AM
"Paul" > wrote in message
m...
> Hello. This is my first time in this NG. I'm hoping the collective
> experience in this NG can point me towards a good book on diet for
> bodybuilding. I know there are tons of books and mags that discuss
> this, so I'm hoping there is one or two that seems to cover all or
> most of what's important and ACCURATE.
>
> I used to lift weights in my late teens and early twenties. I'm short
> (5'7"). Back then, I just ate alot of proteins (meats and shakes) and
> pastas. I managed to bulk up to 160 lbs and was fairly strong for my
> size. Now I'm 39, and just picked up the weights again after 15 years
> off. I started at 142 lbs bodyweight. The guy at the gym sold me
> creatine in tablet form and said that I should increase my calorie
> intake to gain muscle. I have done this for nearly 4 weeks now and now
> weigh 150 lbs.
>
> But my body at 39 is very different than it was at 24. I have alot
> more surface fat obscuring my muscles, and alot more fat around the
> middle. So, at this age, I obviously need to modify my diet to lose
> fat while building muscle. Hence my request in this post.
>
> My basic questions are: (1) how, when, what, do I eat to decrease fat
> and increase muscle AT THE SAME TIME, (2) should and how do I mix
> cardio with weight lifting such that I don't canibalize muscle to burn
> fat, and (3) what supplementation is recommended for my goals (e.g.,
> creatine, protein shakes, fat burners, etc).
>

Without steroid use, it is basically impossible to gain muscle and lose fat
at the same time past the beginner stage for the vast overwhelming majority
of adults. That being the case there is two things you can do to get the
'net effect' of bigger muscles and less fat.

A) Build now, get a little fatter probably, then diet later.

B) Do a cyclic type of diet - build for a while, cut for a while - repeat.
Or a 'micro'-cyclic diet like the UD2 (book) - search in this group you'll
find lots of references to it.

> I'm hoping I can find a book or two that can provide accurate and
> complete answers to these questions, and make me more knowledgable
> about diet and lifestyle in general.

There's tons of excellent info here on this newsgroup for free, but the best
books are mentioned here too. This group should be the basis of your
research and you won't go wrong.

Bob

> Thanks to all for listening.
>
> Paul
>

Paul
September 20th 04, 07:22 PM
Thanks Hugh and Bob for your helpful replies. After much reading both
on the referenced web site and in this NG, I have gleaned what you've
mentioned here. Namely, that I'll need to cycle gain and loss. I am
5'7", 148 lbs at 18% bodyfat. Most of it seems to be around my middle
and back, but I don't appear fat. Just soft. I look more muscular than
the average Joe, but that's not saying much. I'm thinking that I
should start by cutting to get my fat % down to 14 or 15% before I try
to gain. What would you say is a realistic percentage for someone who
wants to get rid of the soft look but doesn't need to be contest ready
either. I have heard that 12% is six-pack territory. To get there I'd
have to lose 6% or 9 lbs of fat. What's a realistic fat loss say, per
month? Do fat burners work? I will do some NG searches to answer my
own questions, but if your so inclined, I'd still appreciate your
thoughts. Thanks again all.

Paul

Bob MacWilliam
September 21st 04, 12:33 AM
"Paul" > wrote in message
m...
> Thanks Hugh and Bob for your helpful replies. After much reading both
> on the referenced web site and in this NG, I have gleaned what you've
> mentioned here. Namely, that I'll need to cycle gain and loss. I am
> 5'7", 148 lbs at 18% bodyfat. Most of it seems to be around my middle
> and back, but I don't appear fat. Just soft. I look more muscular than
> the average Joe, but that's not saying much. I'm thinking that I
> should start by cutting to get my fat % down to 14 or 15% before I try
> to gain. What would you say is a realistic percentage for someone who
> wants to get rid of the soft look but doesn't need to be contest ready
> either. I have heard that 12% is six-pack territory. To get there I'd
> have to lose 6% or 9 lbs of fat. What's a realistic fat loss say, per
> month? Do fat burners work? I will do some NG searches to answer my
> own questions, but if your so inclined, I'd still appreciate your
> thoughts. Thanks again all.
>
> Paul
>

10-12% is fairly lean and it shouldn't be too tough to get there. I get a
4-pack going on at about this level, but my lower abs don't lose the flab
until quite a bit lower.

"6% or 9 lbs of fat." Yes, but some of this will be muscle most likely.
You'll need to lose more than 9 lbs to lose 9 lbs of fat. Don't fret
though, the muscle comes back very quickly. At 148 and 18% you don't have a
huge amount of muscle to spare though. One suggestion is to go on a
moderate bulk for a while, pack on more muscle, then diet into the spring
and summer. Of course only you can decide your priorities.

I lose about 2-4 lbs per week when cutting for a contest. This is a bit
extreme for the average person. One pound/week is probably optimal for
maintaining muscle mass. I just can't wait that long!! It helps though
that I find it easy (probably too easy) to cut calories and really I should
take it a bit slower to hold on to more muscle. This winter I promised
myself that I wouldn't get too fat this time, so I won't have to diet so
hard...

I find that fat burners seem to help with blunting hunger. I generally do
take a fat burner when I diet but I have dieted successfully just by having
a extra couple of coffees per day too. A fat burner is more important for
me sub 9-10% when my body starts to fight more and I get a bit lethargic.
As I mentioned in another post, in this state I can take 24 mg Ephedrine and
200mg caffeine and lie down and go to sleep no problem.

Good luck

Bob

Green Apple Health
September 21st 04, 07:03 AM
Hi Paul,
I have some free reports for you to check out that may help you out:
www.greenapplehealth.com/resources/dietsupplementsrevealed.htm
www.greenapplehealth.com/resources/musclebuildingnutrition.htm
(You will find that these pages they are not free, however, the authors have
allowed me to offer them free to my subcribers. For more info, visit:
www.greenapplehealth.com/subscribe.htm

You will find many answers to the questions you have asked!
Enjoy and good luck!
--
Sincerely,
M. E. Giesbrecht
Green Apple Health
Subscribe to our Free Fitness Newsletter:
www.greenapplehealth.com/subscribe.htm

Visit our Fitness Resources:
www.greenapplehealth.com/resources/dietsupplementsrevealed.htm
www.greenapplehealth.com/resources/musclebuildingnutrition.htm
www.greenapplehealth.com/resources/seriousstrengthtraining.htm
www.greenapplehealth.com/resources/losethebackpain.htm
www.greenapplehealth.com/resources/achievefitness.htm
www.greenapplehealth.com/resources//guaranteedweightloss.htm

"Bob MacWilliam" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Paul" > wrote in message
> m...
>> Hello. This is my first time in this NG. I'm hoping the collective
>> experience in this NG can point me towards a good book on diet for
>> bodybuilding. I know there are tons of books and mags that discuss
>> this, so I'm hoping there is one or two that seems to cover all or
>> most of what's important and ACCURATE.
>>
>> I used to lift weights in my late teens and early twenties. I'm short
>> (5'7"). Back then, I just ate alot of proteins (meats and shakes) and
>> pastas. I managed to bulk up to 160 lbs and was fairly strong for my
>> size. Now I'm 39, and just picked up the weights again after 15 years
>> off. I started at 142 lbs bodyweight. The guy at the gym sold me
>> creatine in tablet form and said that I should increase my calorie
>> intake to gain muscle. I have done this for nearly 4 weeks now and now
>> weigh 150 lbs.
>>
>> But my body at 39 is very different than it was at 24. I have alot
>> more surface fat obscuring my muscles, and alot more fat around the
>> middle. So, at this age, I obviously need to modify my diet to lose
>> fat while building muscle. Hence my request in this post.
>>
>> My basic questions are: (1) how, when, what, do I eat to decrease fat
>> and increase muscle AT THE SAME TIME, (2) should and how do I mix
>> cardio with weight lifting such that I don't canibalize muscle to burn
>> fat, and (3) what supplementation is recommended for my goals (e.g.,
>> creatine, protein shakes, fat burners, etc).
>>
>
> Without steroid use, it is basically impossible to gain muscle and lose
> fat
> at the same time past the beginner stage for the vast overwhelming
> majority
> of adults. That being the case there is two things you can do to get the
> 'net effect' of bigger muscles and less fat.
>
> A) Build now, get a little fatter probably, then diet later.
>
> B) Do a cyclic type of diet - build for a while, cut for a while - repeat.
> Or a 'micro'-cyclic diet like the UD2 (book) - search in this group you'll
> find lots of references to it.
>
>> I'm hoping I can find a book or two that can provide accurate and
>> complete answers to these questions, and make me more knowledgable
>> about diet and lifestyle in general.
>
> There's tons of excellent info here on this newsgroup for free, but the
> best
> books are mentioned here too. This group should be the basis of your
> research and you won't go wrong.
>
> Bob
>
>> Thanks to all for listening.
>>
>> Paul
>>
>
>