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View Full Version : Which is best HST or a split routine ?


Hugh Beaver
December 2nd 03, 01:58 PM
Which is best HST or a split routine of (Back & Biceps) / (Chest, Triceps &
Shoulders) / (Legs & Lower Back)
The HST web site suggests the volume of work should be the same a week of
split routine, so which is best?

I have been going to the gym for just over six months so any advise would be
good. I have workout I can do the below five rep max, two set workout. So
any advise on what to cut or add to the routine would be helpful.

I would like to gain some more strength and get some shape with it. I am 41,
75Kg (165IBs), 5'6, Body fat 15% ish.


Legs
Leg Press 164Kg
Squats 64Kg + smith bar
Leg Curls 17Kg

Chest
Bench slight incline Wide shoulder width grip 18" 36Kg + smith bar
Dips close grip bench Press Narrow grip 6" 36Kg + smith bar
Flyes 13Kg

Back
Straight leg Deadlift 64Kg + smith bar
Chins W&N grip 62Kg (Body weight less 13Kg)
Bent over row (one arm) 28Kg

Traps
Shrugs 28Kg

Shoulders
Lat rear raise 10Kg
Lat raise 11Kg
Shoulder press 52Kg

Biceps
Incline curls 13Kg
Hammer curls 14Kg
Reverse T-bar 39Kg

Triceps
Standing Dips Body weight (75Kg)
Pushdowns Rope 41Kg

Calves
Calf raise (on Step) 60Kg + smith bar

Theresa
December 2nd 03, 10:55 PM
Hugh Beaver wrote:
> Which is best?

HST, probably.

> Leg Press 164Kg
> Squats 64Kg + smith bar
> Leg Curls 17Kg
> Bench slight incline Wide shoulder width grip 18" 36Kg + smith bar
> Dips
> close grip bench Press Narrow grip 6" 36Kg + smith bar
> Flyes 13Kg
> Straight leg Deadlift 64Kg + smith bar
> Chins W&N grip 62Kg (Body weight less 13Kg)
> Bent over row (one arm) 28Kg
> Shrugs 28Kg
> Lat rear raise 10Kg
> Lat raise 11Kg
> Shoulder press 52Kg
> Incline curls 13Kg
> Hammer curls 14Kg
> Reverse T-bar 39Kg
> Standing Dips Body weight (75Kg)
> Pushdowns Rope 41Kg
> Calf raise (on Step) 60Kg + smith bar

Your exercise selection could use a little work, and your poundages. Your
shrug, to pick the most egregious example, is ridiculous.

Also, no more Smith machine, please.

Hugh Beaver
December 3rd 03, 08:44 AM
So are you saying my shrug poundages are remarkably good or remarkable in a
bad sense?

What do you sugest for a better exercise selection and poundages?

Is the Smith machine a bad way of doing lifting, we do not have barbells at
the gym only machines & dumbells.

Why is HST probably best?

Thanks in advance.


"Theresa" > wrote in message
...
> Hugh Beaver wrote:
> > Which is best?
>
> HST, probably.
>
> > Leg Press 164Kg
> > Squats 64Kg + smith bar
> > Leg Curls 17Kg
> > Bench slight incline Wide shoulder width grip 18" 36Kg + smith bar
> > Dips
> > close grip bench Press Narrow grip 6" 36Kg + smith bar
> > Flyes 13Kg
> > Straight leg Deadlift 64Kg + smith bar
> > Chins W&N grip 62Kg (Body weight less 13Kg)
> > Bent over row (one arm) 28Kg
> > Shrugs 28Kg
> > Lat rear raise 10Kg
> > Lat raise 11Kg
> > Shoulder press 52Kg
> > Incline curls 13Kg
> > Hammer curls 14Kg
> > Reverse T-bar 39Kg
> > Standing Dips Body weight (75Kg)
> > Pushdowns Rope 41Kg
> > Calf raise (on Step) 60Kg + smith bar
>
> Your exercise selection could use a little work, and your poundages. Your
> shrug, to pick the most egregious example, is ridiculous.
>
> Also, no more Smith machine, please.
>
>

Roger Zoul
December 3rd 03, 02:43 PM
Hugh Beaver wrote:
:: So are you saying my shrug poundages are remarkably good or
:: remarkable in a bad sense?
::
:: What do you sugest for a better exercise selection and poundages?
::
:: Is the Smith machine a bad way of doing lifting, we do not have
:: barbells at the gym only machines & dumbells.

Use dumbbells. The potential problem with the Smith machine is that it
forces you to move along a certain fixed path, which may not be good for
your body. Free weights allow a natural motion and also force other
"stabilizer" muscles into play -- so they get stronger too. Free weights
are likely better in the long run.

::
:: Why is HST probably best?
::

Well, whose to say really. You can do a split routine and incorporate
principles from HST as well. HST is about muscle growth, so if that is your
thing, go read up.

:::
:::: Leg Press 164Kg
:::: Squats 64Kg + smith bar
:::: Leg Curls 17Kg

Probably don't need all three. See if you can learn to do real squats!

:::: Bench slight incline Wide shoulder width grip 18" 36Kg + smith bar
:::: Dips
:::: close grip bench Press Narrow grip 6" 36Kg + smith bar
:::: Flyes 13Kg

Kill the flyes. You can bench with dumbbells.

:::: Straight leg Deadlift 64Kg + smith bar
::: Chins W&N grip 62Kg (Body weight less 13Kg)
:::: Bent over row (one arm) 28Kg
:::: Lat rear raise 10Kg
:::: Lat raise 11Kg

This

:::: Shrugs 28Kg
:::: Shoulder press 52Kg
:::: Incline curls 13Kg
:::: Hammer curls 14Kg
:::: Reverse T-bar 39Kg
:::: Standing Dips Body weight (75Kg)
:::: Pushdowns Rope 41Kg
:::: Calf raise (on Step) 60Kg + smith bar

I doubt you need two kinds of curls, if any. Do you need another set of
dips?

I suggest you simplify this and group your exercises according to body
parts. Remember too that most chest exercises hit the triceps and front
shoulders, so group those exercises together. Similarly, most back
movements hit the biceps. Also, it is okay to use alternate exercises on
different days in your plan. But you don't really need all of these
movements for the same groups.

I think you need to sit down and work up a plan. More does not equate to
better.

Also, posting weights is a little silly. No one but you can know how much
you can lift on a certain movement.

Jacob Andersen
December 3rd 03, 02:50 PM
"Hugh Beaver" > wrote in message
...
> So are you saying my shrug poundages are remarkably good or remarkable in
a
> bad sense?

Your shrug poundage is very low. Most likely you can lift a lot more.

> What do you sugest for a better exercise selection and poundages?
>
> Is the Smith machine a bad way of doing lifting, we do not have barbells
at
> the gym only machines & dumbells.

Yes, the Smith Machine is a bad way. Specifically some of the lifts you do
in it don't really work well in the smith machine. Most notably the
stiff-legged deadlift. But it's not that great for the bench press either.
The problem is that it forces you to move straight up and down which isn't
how your body moves.

> Why is HST probably best?

It has a pretty good track record.

/Jacob

Theresa
December 3rd 03, 02:57 PM
Hugh Beaver wrote:
> So are you saying my shrug poundages are remarkably good or
> remarkable in a bad sense?

The latter.

> What do you suggest for a better exercise selection and poundages?

Drop the single-joint exercises, pick one multi-joint exercise for each
major muscle group, put enough weight on the barbell that you can't do a
dozen reps.

> Is the Smith machine a bad way of doing lifting, we do not have
> barbells at the gym only machines & dumbbells.

Yes. Change gyms.

> Why is HST probably best?

www.hypertrophy-specific.com


>>> Squat
>>> Bench
>>> Deadlift
>>> Chin
>>> Calf raise

Like that. Okay, I left in a single-joint exercise, flame away.

>> Your exercise selection could use a little work, and your poundages.
>> Your shrug, to pick the most egregious example, is ridiculous.
>>
>> Also, no more Smith machine, please.

R.Coyote
December 4th 03, 05:53 AM
>>> Squat
>>> Bench
>>> Deadlift
>>> Chin
>>> Calf raise

or like...

Squat
Bench
Arnolds
Bent row
Chin
Calf raise

split routines do work
HST works better

Jonathan
December 4th 03, 10:48 AM
> I have been going to the gym for just over six months so any advise would be
> good. I have workout I can do the below five rep max, two set workout. So
> any advise on what to cut or add to the routine would be helpful.
>
> I would like to gain some more strength and get some shape with it. I am 41,
> 75Kg (165IBs), 5'6, Body fat 15% ish.
>
>> Chest
> Bench slight incline Wide shoulder width grip 18" 36Kg + smith bar
> Dips close grip bench Press Narrow grip 6" 36Kg + smith bar
> Flyes 13Kg

>
> Shoulders
> Lat rear raise 10Kg
> Lat raise 11Kg
> Shoulder press 52Kg
>
Are you sure this is right? You can bench press 36kg in the Smith
Machine, but you can press 52kg (presumably also in Smith Machine)
above your head? Surely not?

Jonathan

Russ
December 5th 03, 05:47 AM
Hugh Beaver wrote:

> Why is HST probably best?

Summary of some good points from HST site:
(http://www.hypertrophy-specific.com/hst_index.html)

Exercising body parts 3 times a week gives greater strength gains than
doing each part once a week;

Doing 15 reps for 2 weeks increases muscle endurance and promotes
healing of tendons & ligaments before the heavier part of your workout
schedule.


Russ.

Hugh Beaver
December 5th 03, 09:11 AM
My Shoulder press of 52Kg is not on the Smith, it's using a wide side grip
machine and my Shrugs 28Kg was for two dumbbells each 28Kg, so I should have
put 56Kg, sorry I did not make that very clear.

OK reading all the advice how is this then for HST five reps of two sets:

Squats 64Kg now with dumbbells, will have to get the technique correct.

Leg Curls 17Kg (this is for one leg at a time)

Bench slight incline Wide shoulder width grip 18" 36Kg now with dumbbells

(Dips close grip bench Press Narrow grip 6" 36Kg + smith bar or Standing
Dips Body weight (75Kg)) + Pushdowns Rope 41Kg

Straight leg Deadlift 64Kg + smith bar

Chins Wide grip 62Kg (Body weight less 13Kg) or Bent over row (one arm)
28Kg

Lat rear raise 10Kg

Shrugs 56Kg (this is for two dumbbells each 28Kg)

Shoulder press 52Kg (machine)

(Incline curls 13Kg or Hammer curls 14Kg) + Reverse T-bar 39Kg

Calf raise (on Step, straight leg) 60Kg + smith bar

I will alternate the "or" items each time I do the routine.

Thanks in advance for further advise.


"Jonathan" > wrote in message
om...
> > I have been going to the gym for just over six months so any advise
would be
> > good. I have workout I can do the below five rep max, two set workout.
So
> > any advise on what to cut or add to the routine would be helpful.
> >
> > I would like to gain some more strength and get some shape with it. I am
41,
> > 75Kg (165IBs), 5'6, Body fat 15% ish.
> >
> >> Chest
> > Bench slight incline Wide shoulder width grip 18" 36Kg + smith bar
> > Dips close grip bench Press Narrow grip 6" 36Kg + smith bar
> > Flyes 13Kg
>
> >
> > Shoulders
> > Lat rear raise 10Kg
> > Lat raise 11Kg
> > Shoulder press 52Kg
> >
> Are you sure this is right? You can bench press 36kg in the Smith
> Machine, but you can press 52kg (presumably also in Smith Machine)
> above your head? Surely not?
>
> Jonathan