PDA

View Full Version : Kirkland vitamins any good?


Larry Hodges
September 11th 06, 09:39 PM
So, are they? I was told that the body has a hard time absorbing them. How
about a website that tests certain vitamin brands for quality, etc.?

If they do suck, any recommendations?

-Larry

ATP*
September 12th 06, 01:38 AM
"Larry Hodges" > wrote in message
. ..
> So, are they? I was told that the body has a hard time absorbing them.

Who told you? Although I have no way of testing vitamins, I have had good
experiences with Kirkland coffee, jeans, shirts, luggage, etc.. Costco is an
ethical company with a reputation for value and quality. In the absence of
evidence to the contrary, I trust their vitamins as well.




How
> about a website that tests certain vitamin brands for quality, etc.?
>
> If they do suck, any recommendations?
>
> -Larry
>

September 12th 06, 08:35 PM
Hi Larry,
I know a lot of vitamins out there are crap and do not absorb well in
the body. The best vitamins are made from whole food, such as Nikken
(the best). If you want to know if Kirkland vitamins are good, put one
vitamin in white vinegar to see if it dissolves. White vinegar is
about the same make up of your stomach acid which is why this will
work. If it doesn't dissolve, you have your answer. If it takes too
long to dissolve (more than 3 minutes) it may not be good either. If
it dissolves too fast that isn't good (1 min or less). A lot to this
but try it out for yourself and see if Kirkland is good. Hope this
helps.

Ben Warstler
Build Better Athletes

Larry Hodges wrote:
> So, are they? I was told that the body has a hard time absorbing them. How
> about a website that tests certain vitamin brands for quality, etc.?
>
> If they do suck, any recommendations?
>
> -Larry

September 12th 06, 08:36 PM
Hi Larry,
I know a lot of vitamins out there are crap and do not absorb well in
the body. The best vitamins are made from whole food, such as Nikken
(the best). If you want to know if Kirkland vitamins are good, put one
vitamin in white vinegar to see if it dissolves. White vinegar is
about the same make up of your stomach acid which is why this will
work. If it doesn't dissolve, you have your answer. If it takes too
long to dissolve (more than 3 minutes) it may not be good either. If
it dissolves too fast that isn't good (1 min or less). A lot to this
but try it out for yourself and see if Kirkland is good. Hope this
helps.

Ben Warstler
Build Better Athletes

Larry Hodges wrote:
> So, are they? I was told that the body has a hard time absorbing them. How
> about a website that tests certain vitamin brands for quality, etc.?
>
> If they do suck, any recommendations?
>
> -Larry

David Cohen
September 12th 06, 10:33 PM
> wrote
> Hi Larry,
> I know a lot of vitamins out there are crap and do not absorb well in
> the body.

References, please.

> The best vitamins are made from whole food, such as Nikken
> (the best).

References, please.

> If you want to know if Kirkland vitamins are good, put one
> vitamin in white vinegar to see if it dissolves. White vinegar is
> about the same make up of your stomach acid which is why this will
> work. If it doesn't dissolve, you have your answer. If it takes too
> long to dissolve (more than 3 minutes) it may not be good either.

Yeah, because most people have a 3 minute gastric transit time.

> If
> it dissolves too fast that isn't good (1 min or less).

References, please.

> A lot to this
> but try it out for yourself and see if Kirkland is good. Hope this
> helps.

Oh, I'm sure it does. Larry was in need of a good laugh. You have truly
helped.

> Ben Warstler
> Build Better Athletes

You build them with Legos, don't you?

Thought so.

David

Jason Earl
September 12th 06, 11:42 PM
"David Cohen" > writes:

> > wrote
>> Hi Larry, I know a lot of vitamins out there are crap and do not
>> absorb well in the body.
>
> References, please.
>
>> The best vitamins are made from whole food, such as Nikken (the
>> best).
>
> References, please.

I didn't want to say anything, but now I can't help but pile on here.
I have a family member that is always trying to sell me some Nikken
stuff and so I have looked into their "products." I have a hard time
getting excited about any company's "fitness" products that would try
and sell me expensive weighted shoes as an alternative to exercise.

http://www.nikken.com/index.cfm?fuse=prod1&prod_id=1910

>> If you want to know if Kirkland vitamins are good, put one vitamin
>> in white vinegar to see if it dissolves. White vinegar is about
>> the same make up of your stomach acid which is why this will work.
>> If it doesn't dissolve, you have your answer. If it takes too long
>> to dissolve (more than 3 minutes) it may not be good either.
>
> Yeah, because most people have a 3 minute gastric transit time.

So how would *you* judge whether a vitamin is good or not. I
currently am taking (I kid you not) Flintstone's Chewables because my
kids won't eat them and I am too cheap to throw them away. When those
are gone I will probably buy the Kirkland brand vitamins because I
like shopping at Costco, and I like the Kirkland brand.

If I had any idea what they put in a "good" vitamin I would compare
myself, but I don't really have an idea as to what constitutes a good
multivitamin. Chances are fair that Kirkland's vitamins will be "good
enough" for me, but I'm always curious.

>> If it dissolves too fast that isn't good (1 min or less).
>
> References, please.
>
>> A lot to this but try it out for yourself and see if Kirkland is
>> good. Hope this helps.
>
> Oh, I'm sure it does. Larry was in need of a good laugh. You have
> truly helped.

Jason

Curt James
September 12th 06, 11:52 PM
Jason Earl wrote:
> "David Cohen" writes:
> > > wrote
> >> Hi Larry, I know a lot of vitamins out there are crap and do not
> >> absorb well in the body.
> >
> > References, please.
> >
> >> The best vitamins are made from whole food, such as Nikken (the
> >> best).
> >
> > References, please.
>
> I didn't want to say anything, but now I can't help but pile on here.
> I have a family member that is always trying to sell me some Nikken
> stuff and so I have looked into their "products." I have a hard time
> getting excited about any company's "fitness" products that would try
> and sell me expensive weighted shoes as an alternative to exercise.
>
> http://www.nikken.com/index.cfm?fuse=prod1&prod_id=1910
>
> >> If you want to know if Kirkland vitamins are good, put one vitamin
> >> in white vinegar to see if it dissolves. White vinegar is about
> >> the same make up of your stomach acid which is why this will work.
> >> If it doesn't dissolve, you have your answer. If it takes too long
> >> to dissolve (more than 3 minutes) it may not be good either.
> >
> > Yeah, because most people have a 3 minute gastric transit time.
>
> So how would *you* judge whether a vitamin is good or not.

My first thought was Consumer Reports, however their advice
<http://www.consumerreports.org/mg/drug-reports/multivitamins.htm>
amounted to, "Ask your pharmacist any questions you have about
multivitamins."

Not what I expected, but not such a bad first step, I suppose.

> I currently am taking (I kid you not) Flintstone's Chewables because my
> kids won't eat them and I am too cheap to throw them away. When those
> are gone I will probably buy the Kirkland brand vitamins because I
> like shopping at Costco, and I like the Kirkland brand.
>
> If I had any idea what they put in a "good" vitamin I would compare
> myself, but I don't really have an idea as to what constitutes a good
> multivitamin. Chances are fair that Kirkland's vitamins will be "good
> enough" for me, but I'm always curious.
[...]

> Jason

--
Curt

David Cohen
September 13th 06, 12:49 AM
"Curt James" > wrote
> Jason Earl wrote:
>> "David Cohen" writes:
>> > > wrote
>> >> Hi Larry, I know a lot of vitamins out there are crap and do not
>> >> absorb well in the body.
>> >
>> > References, please.
>> >
>> >> The best vitamins are made from whole food, such as Nikken (the
>> >> best).
>> >
>> > References, please.
>>
>> I didn't want to say anything, but now I can't help but pile on here.
>> I have a family member that is always trying to sell me some Nikken
>> stuff and so I have looked into their "products." I have a hard time
>> getting excited about any company's "fitness" products that would try
>> and sell me expensive weighted shoes as an alternative to exercise.
>>
>> http://www.nikken.com/index.cfm?fuse=prod1&prod_id=1910
>>
>> >> If you want to know if Kirkland vitamins are good, put one vitamin
>> >> in white vinegar to see if it dissolves. White vinegar is about
>> >> the same make up of your stomach acid which is why this will work.
>> >> If it doesn't dissolve, you have your answer. If it takes too long
>> >> to dissolve (more than 3 minutes) it may not be good either.
>> >
>> > Yeah, because most people have a 3 minute gastric transit time.
>>
>> So how would *you* judge whether a vitamin is good or not.
>
> My first thought was Consumer Reports, however their advice
> <http://www.consumerreports.org/mg/drug-reports/multivitamins.htm>
> amounted to, "Ask your pharmacist any questions you have about
> multivitamins."

I love Consumer Reports when it comes to cars, cameras, dishwashers, and
stuff like that.

When it comes to anything involving medical type issues, I have found their
advice well and truly sucks.

David

David Cohen
September 13th 06, 12:59 AM
"Jason Earl" > wrote
> "David Cohen" > writes:
>> > wrote
>>> Hi Larry, I know a lot of vitamins out there are crap and do not
>>> absorb well in the body.
>>
>> References, please.
>>
>>> The best vitamins are made from whole food, such as Nikken (the
>>> best).
>>
>> References, please.
>
> I didn't want to say anything, but now I can't help but pile on here.
> I have a family member that is always trying to sell me some Nikken
> stuff and so I have looked into their "products." I have a hard time
> getting excited about any company's "fitness" products that would try
> and sell me expensive weighted shoes as an alternative to exercise.
>
> http://www.nikken.com/index.cfm?fuse=prod1&prod_id=1910
>
>>> If you want to know if Kirkland vitamins are good, put one vitamin
>>> in white vinegar to see if it dissolves. White vinegar is about
>>> the same make up of your stomach acid which is why this will work.
>>> If it doesn't dissolve, you have your answer. If it takes too long
>>> to dissolve (more than 3 minutes) it may not be good either.
>>
>> Yeah, because most people have a 3 minute gastric transit time.
>
> So how would *you* judge whether a vitamin is good or not. I
> currently am taking (I kid you not) Flintstone's Chewables because my
> kids won't eat them and I am too cheap to throw them away. When those
> are gone I will probably buy the Kirkland brand vitamins because I
> like shopping at Costco, and I like the Kirkland brand.
>
> If I had any idea what they put in a "good" vitamin I would compare
> myself, but I don't really have an idea as to what constitutes a good
> multivitamin. Chances are fair that Kirkland's vitamins will be "good
> enough" for me, but I'm always curious.

The ingredients in standard vitamin/mineral tablets are widely available and
relatively cheap, so, they are all "good" if they contain the micronutrients
that you want. If Flintstone Chewables has the nutrient profile that you
ant, it's just fine.

What one desires in their multinutrient supplement is an entire different
subject. I want all kinds of stuff in there, in big amounts, and am willing
to pay to get it, so, I buy Life Extension Foundation's LE Mix and LE
Booster...10 tabs, about $2, a day...as the start of my supplementation. But
that's what I want, and what I'm willing to pay. If a Kirkland tablet, or a
grape Bam Bam, is what you want, it's all ok with me.

David

jimmy
September 13th 06, 03:17 AM
I remember seeing a news story that said that almost all vitamins are
manufactured by only a handful of companies.

Some brand names charge more for the same tablets even though most
vitamins come from the same sources.

Larry Hodges wrote:
> So, are they? I was told that the body has a hard time absorbing them. How
> about a website that tests certain vitamin brands for quality, etc.?
>
> If they do suck, any recommendations?
>
> -Larry

Jason Earl
September 13th 06, 04:26 AM
"David Cohen" > writes:

> "Jason Earl" > wrote
>> "David Cohen" > writes:
>>> > wrote
>>>> Hi Larry, I know a lot of vitamins out there are crap and do not
>>>> absorb well in the body.
>>>
>>> References, please.
>>>
>>>> The best vitamins are made from whole food, such as Nikken (the
>>>> best).
>>>
>>> References, please.
>>
>> I didn't want to say anything, but now I can't help but pile on
>> here. I have a family member that is always trying to sell me some
>> Nikken stuff and so I have looked into their "products." I have a
>> hard time getting excited about any company's "fitness" products
>> that would try and sell me expensive weighted shoes as an
>> alternative to exercise.
>>
>> http://www.nikken.com/index.cfm?fuse=prod1&prod_id=1910
>>
>>>> If you want to know if Kirkland vitamins are good, put one
>>>> vitamin in white vinegar to see if it dissolves. White vinegar
>>>> is about the same make up of your stomach acid which is why this
>>>> will work. If it doesn't dissolve, you have your answer. If it
>>>> takes too long to dissolve (more than 3 minutes) it may not be
>>>> good either.
>>>
>>> Yeah, because most people have a 3 minute gastric transit time.
>>
>> So how would *you* judge whether a vitamin is good or not. I
>> currently am taking (I kid you not) Flintstone's Chewables because
>> my kids won't eat them and I am too cheap to throw them away. When
>> those are gone I will probably buy the Kirkland brand vitamins
>> because I like shopping at Costco, and I like the Kirkland brand.
>>
>> If I had any idea what they put in a "good" vitamin I would compare
>> myself, but I don't really have an idea as to what constitutes a
>> good multivitamin. Chances are fair that Kirkland's vitamins will
>> be "good enough" for me, but I'm always curious.
>
> The ingredients in standard vitamin/mineral tablets are widely
> available and relatively cheap, so, they are all "good" if they
> contain the micronutrients that you want. If Flintstone Chewables
> has the nutrient profile that you ant, it's just fine.

I suppose that's the problem. I have no idea what nutrient profile I
want :).

> What one desires in their multinutrient supplement is an entire
> different subject. I want all kinds of stuff in there, in big
> amounts, and am willing to pay to get it, so, I buy Life Extension
> Foundation's LE Mix and LE Booster...10 tabs, about $2, a day...as
> the start of my supplementation. But that's what I want, and what
> I'm willing to pay. If a Kirkland tablet, or a grape Bam Bam, is
> what you want, it's all ok with me.

OK, that's the information I wanted. Woah, lef.org has a pile of
products... This might take a while.

Thanks,

Jason

joanne
September 13th 06, 06:12 AM
Jason Earl wrote:
> So how would *you* judge whether a vitamin is good or not. I
> currently am taking (I kid you not) Flintstone's Chewables because my
> kids won't eat them and I am too cheap to throw them away. When those
> are gone I will probably buy the Kirkland brand vitamins because I
> like shopping at Costco, and I like the Kirkland brand.

Take the bottle with you to compare the labels. Compare cost to serving
size and of course the ingredients. I would suggest the Kirkland High
Energy vitamin packs - they are 90 for under $27.00
http://www.vitasprings.com/kirkland-signature--high-energy-dietary-supplement.html

> If I had any idea what they put in a "good" vitamin I would compare
> myself, but I don't really have an idea as to what constitutes a good
> multivitamin.

You want the basics .. vitamins a, b-complex, c/d/k/folic acid and
minerals. Past that multi vitamin complex is totally up to you what you
want to add. Ask anyone thats into supplements and they will list a
multi plus probably ten other things they take daily for various
reasons. An interesting read about Dr Bruce Ames and why everyone
should take at the very least a daily multivitamin:
http://www.juvenon.com/pdfs/june05_ames-prescrip.pdf


joanne

David Cohen
September 13th 06, 07:41 AM
"Jason Earl" > wrote
> "David Cohen" > writes:
>> "Jason Earl" > wrote
>>> "David Cohen" > writes:
>>>> > wrote
>>>>> Hi Larry, I know a lot of vitamins out there are crap and do not
>>>>> absorb well in the body.
>>>>
>>>> References, please.
>>>>
>>>>> The best vitamins are made from whole food, such as Nikken (the
>>>>> best).
>>>>
>>>> References, please.
>>>
>>> I didn't want to say anything, but now I can't help but pile on
>>> here. I have a family member that is always trying to sell me some
>>> Nikken stuff and so I have looked into their "products." I have a
>>> hard time getting excited about any company's "fitness" products
>>> that would try and sell me expensive weighted shoes as an
>>> alternative to exercise.
>>>
>>> http://www.nikken.com/index.cfm?fuse=prod1&prod_id=1910
>>>
>>>>> If you want to know if Kirkland vitamins are good, put one
>>>>> vitamin in white vinegar to see if it dissolves. White vinegar
>>>>> is about the same make up of your stomach acid which is why this
>>>>> will work. If it doesn't dissolve, you have your answer. If it
>>>>> takes too long to dissolve (more than 3 minutes) it may not be
>>>>> good either.
>>>>
>>>> Yeah, because most people have a 3 minute gastric transit time.
>>>
>>> So how would *you* judge whether a vitamin is good or not. I
>>> currently am taking (I kid you not) Flintstone's Chewables because
>>> my kids won't eat them and I am too cheap to throw them away. When
>>> those are gone I will probably buy the Kirkland brand vitamins
>>> because I like shopping at Costco, and I like the Kirkland brand.
>>>
>>> If I had any idea what they put in a "good" vitamin I would compare
>>> myself, but I don't really have an idea as to what constitutes a
>>> good multivitamin. Chances are fair that Kirkland's vitamins will
>>> be "good enough" for me, but I'm always curious.
>>
>> The ingredients in standard vitamin/mineral tablets are widely
>> available and relatively cheap, so, they are all "good" if they
>> contain the micronutrients that you want. If Flintstone Chewables
>> has the nutrient profile that you ant, it's just fine.
>
> I suppose that's the problem. I have no idea what nutrient profile I
> want :).
>
>> What one desires in their multinutrient supplement is an entire
>> different subject. I want all kinds of stuff in there, in big
>> amounts, and am willing to pay to get it, so, I buy Life Extension
>> Foundation's LE Mix and LE Booster...10 tabs, about $2, a day...as
>> the start of my supplementation. But that's what I want, and what
>> I'm willing to pay. If a Kirkland tablet, or a grape Bam Bam, is
>> what you want, it's all ok with me.
>
> OK, that's the information I wanted. Woah, lef.org has a pile of
> products... This might take a while.

I do NOT recommend anyone else take LE Mix or any of their other products,
based solely on my word. Beyond a basic multi...like a nice tasty
Pebbles...the choice of what to supplement is as much a philosophical
question as a medical one. Although unlike Mr Balancethroughwellness, LEF
provides buttloads of references to support their ingredients, from the
medical point of view. As far as the philosophical point of view, just
supplement whatever God wants you to :)

Hmmm...I wonder if there is a biblical/religious viewpoint on
supplementation?

David

BradandBrooks
September 13th 06, 10:38 AM
Why not just eat a proper diet?

As someone at military college told me a looong time ago:

You're forefathers in the special forces, never took vitamins or creatine.
They never took protein powder or anything else. And they'd kick your ass,
left, right and centre. So, why do you bother to take these things?

Waste of money.

Anyone want to respond why vitamins are necessary if you're eating properly?

I'm curious.

Brad

> wrote in message
ups.com...
> Hi Larry,
> I know a lot of vitamins out there are crap and do not absorb well in
> the body. The best vitamins are made from whole food, such as Nikken
> (the best). If you want to know if Kirkland vitamins are good, put one
> vitamin in white vinegar to see if it dissolves. White vinegar is
> about the same make up of your stomach acid which is why this will
> work. If it doesn't dissolve, you have your answer. If it takes too
> long to dissolve (more than 3 minutes) it may not be good either. If
> it dissolves too fast that isn't good (1 min or less). A lot to this
> but try it out for yourself and see if Kirkland is good. Hope this
> helps.
>
> Ben Warstler
> Build Better Athletes
>
> Larry Hodges wrote:
>> So, are they? I was told that the body has a hard time absorbing them.
>> How
>> about a website that tests certain vitamin brands for quality, etc.?
>>
>> If they do suck, any recommendations?
>>
>> -Larry
>

Will Brink
September 13th 06, 02:22 PM
In article . net>,
"David Cohen" > wrote:


>
> I love Consumer Reports when it comes to cars, cameras, dishwashers, and
> stuff like that.
>
> When it comes to anything involving medical type issues, I have found their
> advice well and truly sucks.
>
> David

That sums up my opinion of consumer reports also. They really should stay
away from health/nutrition advice. They really suck at it.

Will Brink
September 13th 06, 02:28 PM
In article et>, "David
Cohen" > wrote:

>
> What one desires in their multinutrient supplement is an entire different
> subject. I want all kinds of stuff in there, in big amounts, and am willing
> to pay to get it, so, I buy Life Extension Foundation's LE Mix and LE
> Booster...10 tabs, about $2, a day...as the start of my supplementation. But
> that's what I want, and what I'm willing to pay.

I have not run the numbers yet, but my hunch is it's cheaper mg for mg to
take LEF vites over a centrum anyway.

Will Brink
September 13th 06, 02:31 PM
In article >, Jason Earl
> wrote:

>
> OK, that's the information I wanted. Woah, lef.org has a pile of
> products... This might take a while.

I have used and recommended the LEF for many years. I use their multi,
whey, creatine, DHEA, and fish oil/GLA supps.

Will Brink
September 13th 06, 04:01 PM
In article <[email protected]>, "BradandBrooks"
> wrote:

> Why not just eat a proper diet?

Why not do both? Since when does a "proper diet" supply optimal amounts of
nutrients?

>
> As someone at military college told me a looong time ago:
>
> You're forefathers in the special forces, never took vitamins or creatine.
> They never took protein powder or anything else. And they'd kick your ass,
> left, right and centre. So, why do you bother to take these things?

The forefathers of SOF also didn't have SAT Nav devices, night scopes,
etc, etc, yet it's standard issue now. Any edge can be the difference
between life and death. If one wants to "tough it out" in their SOF
training because the guys before them did, that's fine, but many are
willing to use any edge they can get, which includes supps, equipment, and
"other" stuff past generations of SOF didn't have access to.


>
> Waste of money.

Depends.

>
> Anyone want to respond why vitamins are necessary if you're eating properly?

Define "necessary" and since when did anyone in SOF (to use your example)
ever eat properly? A good multi should be standard issue in my view.

TheGist
September 13th 06, 04:22 PM
Larry Hodges wrote:
> So, are they? I was told that the body has a hard time absorbing them. How
> about a website that tests certain vitamin brands for quality, etc.?
>
> If they do suck, any recommendations?

I have no idea about good vs bad vitamins.
I will admit to the group, however, that I do take Animal Pak
vitamins. :)

joanne
September 13th 06, 05:04 PM
BradandBrooks wrote:
> Why not just eat a proper diet?
> As someone at military college told me a looong time ago:
> You're forefathers in the special forces, never took vitamins or creatine.
> They never took protein powder or anything else. And they'd kick your ass,
> left, right and centre. So, why do you bother to take these things?
> Waste of money.

Altho they mightve 'kicked ass' they also died alot younger back then
too. People always miss that fact when saying how great it was 'back
then'.

> Anyone want to respond why vitamins are necessary if you're eating properly?

You cannot get what you need from food alone - for various reasons.
Mostly because we are not willing or knowledgeable to eat what it takes
to get everything our bodies need on a daily basis. So a persons
learning curve limits them in knowing what foods to eat with what other
foods to increase absorbtion etc - a multivitamin ensures you are
getting some of your basic needs met even if you think you are eating
'properly'. Todays overfarming practices also limits how much of
particular nutrients are actually in said food items. One carrot from
farm A might not be the same as one from far B so eating right cannot
necessarily equal good health thru proper nutrition.
Certainly not a waste of money, supplementing (as an informed consumer
that is) is the way to go.



joanne

Jason Earl
September 13th 06, 05:36 PM
"BradandBrooks" > writes:

> Why not just eat a proper diet?

Clearly that's a first step. However, there's a wide range of
opinions as to what constitutes a "proper" diet. That's part of the
reason that I like discussing this stuff. It's a learning experience.

> As someone at military college told me a looong time ago:
>
> You're forefathers in the special forces, never took vitamins or
> creatine. They never took protein powder or anything else. And
> they'd kick your ass, left, right and centre. So, why do you bother
> to take these things?

They also had much shorter life expectancies.

Quite frankly, my "forefathers" did lots of things that are just plain
stupid. I had the opportunity to be involved in a re-enactment of the
Mormon handcart companies from the 1840s this summer and I learned
some interesting stuff. For example, did you know that the second
leading cause of death for women on the frontier was from burns on the
legs. Apparently, the long skirts that the commonly wore had a
distinct tendency to catch fire while the women were cooking. The
women would then die from the infected burns. At some point you would
think that the women would simply adopt pants, but that's not what
happened.

Americans today also tend to be much bigger than their forefathers.
I've read the Journals from a few of my ancestors from the 1800s and I
have access to pictures that were taken of them, and they were tiny.
At 6'2" 220 lbs. I would be a giant had I lived 150 years ago.

So don't tell me that what was good enough for my great great great
grandparents should be good enough for me, because I am not buying.

> Waste of money.

Vitamins are far cheaper than food. Even Cohen's fancy-schmancy
vitamins are only $2 a day. The fish oil tablets I take are like $0.5
apiece. I would have to eat nothing but fish to get the same amount
of EFAs that I get with a hand full of capsules.

> Anyone want to respond why vitamins are necessary if you're eating
> properly?

Clearly vitamins are not "necessary." Unless, of course, your diet
consists of hard tack and salt pork, in which case mixing in a little
vitamin C would help you avoid scurvy. Lifting weights isn't
necessary either.

Vitamins are simply an easy way to make sure that you aren't missing
anything essential. It has also been shown that there are benefits
from some vitamins in quantities that are hard to get from a "natural"
diet. Clearly, what you eat should be your first line of defense, but
that hardly makes vitamins worthless.

Jason

Jason Earl
September 13th 06, 05:39 PM
(Will Brink) writes:

> In article . net>,
> "David Cohen" > wrote:
>
>
>>
>> I love Consumer Reports when it comes to cars, cameras,
>> dishwashers, and stuff like that.
>>
>> When it comes to anything involving medical type issues, I have
>> found their advice well and truly sucks.
>>
>> David
>
> That sums up my opinion of consumer reports also. They really should
> stay away from health/nutrition advice. They really suck at it.

The folks that *really* know cars, cameras, and dishwashers probably
feel that Consumer Reports is only good at health/nutrition advice.

Jason

Steve Freides
September 13th 06, 05:50 PM
"Jason Earl" > wrote in message
...
> (Will Brink) writes:
>
>> In article . net>,
>> "David Cohen" > wrote:
>>
>>
>>>
>>> I love Consumer Reports when it comes to cars, cameras,
>>> dishwashers, and stuff like that.
>>>
>>> When it comes to anything involving medical type issues, I have
>>> found their advice well and truly sucks.
>>>
>>> David
>>
>> That sums up my opinion of consumer reports also. They really should
>> stay away from health/nutrition advice. They really suck at it.
>
> The folks that *really* know cars, cameras, and dishwashers probably
> feel that Consumer Reports is only good at health/nutrition advice.

Consumer Reports is only palatable reading for areas that aren't one's
specialty. Back in the day when I had a small recording studio and was
just generally into high-end audio, I remember having the same reaction
to their reviews of consumer audio electronics like tape decks. I
stopped subscribing years ago - you can read them in the local library
if you really need.

-S-
http://www.kbnj.com

Jason Earl
September 13th 06, 06:03 PM
"Steve Freides" > writes:

> "Jason Earl" > wrote in message
> ...
>> (Will Brink) writes:
>>
>>> In article . net>,
>>> "David Cohen" > wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>> I love Consumer Reports when it comes to cars, cameras,
>>>> dishwashers, and stuff like that.
>>>>
>>>> When it comes to anything involving medical type issues, I have
>>>> found their advice well and truly sucks.
>>>>
>>>> David
>>>
>>> That sums up my opinion of consumer reports also. They really
>>> should stay away from health/nutrition advice. They really suck at
>>> it.
>>
>> The folks that *really* know cars, cameras, and dishwashers
>> probably feel that Consumer Reports is only good at
>> health/nutrition advice.
>
> Consumer Reports is only palatable reading for areas that aren't
> one's specialty. Back in the day when I had a small recording
> studio and was just generally into high-end audio, I remember having
> the same reaction to their reviews of consumer audio electronics
> like tape decks. I stopped subscribing years ago - you can read
> them in the local library if you really need.

That was pretty much exactly what I was getting at. Any time I have
taken the time to actually do my homework it invariably turns out that
the advice of Consumer Reports is lacking.

Jason

JMW
September 13th 06, 06:09 PM
"BradandBrooks" > wrote:

>Why not just eat a proper diet?
>
>As someone at military college told me a looong time ago:
>
>You're forefathers in the special forces, never took vitamins or creatine.
>They never took protein powder or anything else. And they'd kick your ass,
>left, right and centre. So, why do you bother to take these things?
>
>Waste of money.
>
>Anyone want to respond why vitamins are necessary if you're eating properly?
>
>I'm curious.

Much of the death and incapacitation in historic military campaigns
came from malnutrition and disease, some of which may have been
preventable with supplementation of proper nutrients (e.g., scurvy in
sailors who lacked adequate vitamin C). The military only gives a
**** about powering troops with sufficient calories; that's why MREs
are so calorie-rich.

Think of vitamins as nutritional Kevlar.

Will Brink
September 13th 06, 07:14 PM
In article >, "Steve Freides"
> wrote:

> "Jason Earl" > wrote in message
> ...
> > (Will Brink) writes:
> >
> >> In article . net>,
> >> "David Cohen" > wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>>
> >>> I love Consumer Reports when it comes to cars, cameras,
> >>> dishwashers, and stuff like that.
> >>>
> >>> When it comes to anything involving medical type issues, I have
> >>> found their advice well and truly sucks.
> >>>
> >>> David
> >>
> >> That sums up my opinion of consumer reports also. They really should
> >> stay away from health/nutrition advice. They really suck at it.
> >
> > The folks that *really* know cars, cameras, and dishwashers probably
> > feel that Consumer Reports is only good at health/nutrition advice.
>
> Consumer Reports is only palatable reading for areas that aren't one's
> specialty. Back in the day when I had a small recording studio and was
> just generally into high-end audio, I remember having the same reaction
> to their reviews of consumer audio electronics like tape decks.

You are totally right there. Their reviews of anything audio related is
terrible.

> I
> stopped subscribing years ago - you can read them in the local library
> if you really need.

I stll enjoy consumer reports myself.
>
> -S-
> http://www.kbnj.com

Steve Freides
September 13th 06, 07:16 PM
"BradandBrooks" > wrote in message
news:[email protected]
> Why not just eat a proper diet?
>
> As someone at military college told me a looong time ago:
>
> You're forefathers in the special forces, never took vitamins or
> creatine. They never took protein powder or anything else. And they'd
> kick your ass, left, right and centre. So, why do you bother to take
> these things?
>
> Waste of money.
>
> Anyone want to respond why vitamins are necessary if you're eating
> properly?

And while you're at it, define "eating properly." I was a sickly child
back in the "good old days" and I'm a much healthier adult. I attribute
part of my success to realizing, regardless of what food back in the
good old days had or didn't in terms of nutrition, I do better eating
today's food, today, by taking a few vitamins in addition. The only
"proper" way of eating might be to eat only locally, organically grown
food and even then ...

> I'm curious.

I think you've gotten a few answers.

-S-
http://www.kbnj.com

>
> Brad
>
> > wrote in message
> ups.com...
>> Hi Larry,
>> I know a lot of vitamins out there are crap and do not absorb well in
>> the body. The best vitamins are made from whole food, such as Nikken
>> (the best). If you want to know if Kirkland vitamins are good, put
>> one
>> vitamin in white vinegar to see if it dissolves. White vinegar is
>> about the same make up of your stomach acid which is why this will
>> work. If it doesn't dissolve, you have your answer. If it takes too
>> long to dissolve (more than 3 minutes) it may not be good either. If
>> it dissolves too fast that isn't good (1 min or less). A lot to
>> this
>> but try it out for yourself and see if Kirkland is good. Hope this
>> helps.
>>
>> Ben Warstler
>> Build Better Athletes
>>
>> Larry Hodges wrote:
>>> So, are they? I was told that the body has a hard time absorbing
>>> them. How
>>> about a website that tests certain vitamin brands for quality, etc.?
>>>
>>> If they do suck, any recommendations?
>>>
>>> -Larry
>>
>
>

Neil Gendzwill
September 13th 06, 08:31 PM
Will Brink wrote:
> In article >, "Steve Freides"
> > wrote:
>
>
>>"Jason Earl" > wrote in message
...
>>
(Will Brink) writes:
>>>
>>>The folks that *really* know cars, cameras, and dishwashers probably
>>>feel that Consumer Reports is only good at health/nutrition advice.
>>
>>Consumer Reports is only palatable reading for areas that aren't one's
>>specialty. Back in the day when I had a small recording studio and was
>>just generally into high-end audio, I remember having the same reaction
>>to their reviews of consumer audio electronics like tape decks.
>
> You are totally right there. Their reviews of anything audio related is
> terrible.

It's only terrible if you are an audiophile or a car nut and I'm
speaking as someone who is both. If you can get past your own
prejudices towards audio fidelity, driving performance or whatever, I
think there are useful recommendations for the general consumer. For
most people, a Japanese integrated amp is plenty good enough and a Yaris
is outside their perfomance driving envelope, so specs about
reliability, luggage space and such are what they need.

Neil

BradandBrooks
September 14th 06, 05:02 AM
"Steve Freides" > wrote in message
...
> "BradandBrooks" > wrote in message
> news:[email protected]
>> Why not just eat a proper diet?
>>
>> As someone at military college told me a looong time ago:
>>
>> You're forefathers in the special forces, never took vitamins or
>> creatine. They never took protein powder or anything else. And they'd
>> kick your ass, left, right and centre. So, why do you bother to take
>> these things?
>>
>> Waste of money.
>>
>> Anyone want to respond why vitamins are necessary if you're eating
>> properly?
>
> And while you're at it, define "eating properly." I was a sickly child
> back in the "good old days" and I'm a much healthier adult. I attribute
> part of my success to realizing, regardless of what food back in the good
> old days had or didn't in terms of nutrition, I do better eating today's
> food, today, by taking a few vitamins in addition. The only "proper" way
> of eating might be to eat only locally, organically grown food and even
> then ...
>
>> I'm curious.
>
> I think you've gotten a few answers.
>
> -S-
> http://www.kbnj.com
>

I think I have... :) Thanks for chiming in guys. There are still some
useful opinions left on this group. :)

Brad

>>
>> Brad
>>
>> > wrote in message
>> ups.com...
>>> Hi Larry,
>>> I know a lot of vitamins out there are crap and do not absorb well in
>>> the body. The best vitamins are made from whole food, such as Nikken
>>> (the best). If you want to know if Kirkland vitamins are good, put one
>>> vitamin in white vinegar to see if it dissolves. White vinegar is
>>> about the same make up of your stomach acid which is why this will
>>> work. If it doesn't dissolve, you have your answer. If it takes too
>>> long to dissolve (more than 3 minutes) it may not be good either. If
>>> it dissolves too fast that isn't good (1 min or less). A lot to this
>>> but try it out for yourself and see if Kirkland is good. Hope this
>>> helps.
>>>
>>> Ben Warstler
>>> Build Better Athletes
>>>
>>> Larry Hodges wrote:
>>>> So, are they? I was told that the body has a hard time absorbing them.
>>>> How
>>>> about a website that tests certain vitamin brands for quality, etc.?
>>>>
>>>> If they do suck, any recommendations?
>>>>
>>>> -Larry
>>>
>>
>>
>
>

Art S
September 14th 06, 07:52 AM
"BradandBrooks" > wrote in message news:[email protected]
> Why not just eat a proper diet?
>
> As someone at military college told me a looong time ago:
>
> You're forefathers in the special forces, never took vitamins or creatine. They never took protein
> powder or anything else. And they'd kick your ass, left, right and centre. So, why do you bother
> to take these things?
>
> Waste of money.
>
> Anyone want to respond why vitamins are necessary if you're eating properly?
>
> I'm curious.

The last I heard, in many cases vegetables and fruit grown today (in the USA)
has fewer nutrients than in the past because the soil is getting exhausted and
many of the minerals extracted by the plants aren't replenished.

In addition, fruits and vegetables are being selected for use based on how well
they can be shipped and not for taste (how much do you enjoy eating cardboard?)
When I lived in California, I loved peaches, plums, strawberries, etc. They
tasted sweet. Now I might buy some peaches, but I will go through one or two
bins and only find three - if I'm lucky - that smell sweet (like a ripe peach). The
others? I don't even bother.

Art

Jason Earl
September 14th 06, 03:41 PM
"Art S" > writes:

> "BradandBrooks" > wrote in message
> news:[email protected]
>> Why not just eat a proper diet?
>>
>> As someone at military college told me a looong time ago:
>>
>> You're forefathers in the special forces, never took vitamins or
>> creatine. They never took protein powder or anything else. And
>> they'd kick your ass, left, right and centre. So, why do you bother
>> to take these things?
>>
>> Waste of money.
>>
>> Anyone want to respond why vitamins are necessary if you're eating
>> properly?
>>
>> I'm curious.
>
> The last I heard, in many cases vegetables and fruit grown today (in
> the USA) has fewer nutrients than in the past because the soil is
> getting exhausted and many of the minerals extracted by the plants
> aren't replenished.

I suppose that it is possible that farmers are overtaxing the soil
with vegetables, but fruit? It's not like orchards work differently
today than they always have. It's not like you can rotate tree-based
crops.

> In addition, fruits and vegetables are being selected for use based
> on how well they can be shipped and not for taste (how much do you
> enjoy eating cardboard?) When I lived in California, I loved
> peaches, plums, strawberries, etc. They tasted sweet. Now I might
> buy some peaches, but I will go through one or two bins and only
> find three - if I'm lucky - that smell sweet (like a ripe peach).
> The others? I don't even bother.

The difference is that in California you were probably buying tree or
vine-ripened fruit while in other parts of the country you were almost
certainly buying fruits and vegetables that were picked early and
allowed to ripen in transit. There's a big difference.

Chances are good that if you went to your local farmers market (in
season) you'd be able to get similar tasting fruit.

Jason

Art S
September 14th 06, 03:55 PM
"Jason Earl" > wrote in message ...
> "Art S" > writes:
>
>> "BradandBrooks" > wrote in message
>> news:[email protected]
>>> Why not just eat a proper diet?
>>>
>>> As someone at military college told me a looong time ago:
>>>
>>> You're forefathers in the special forces, never took vitamins or
>>> creatine. They never took protein powder or anything else. And
>>> they'd kick your ass, left, right and centre. So, why do you bother
>>> to take these things?
>>>
>>> Waste of money.
>>>
>>> Anyone want to respond why vitamins are necessary if you're eating
>>> properly?
>>>
>>> I'm curious.
>>
>> The last I heard, in many cases vegetables and fruit grown today (in
>> the USA) has fewer nutrients than in the past because the soil is
>> getting exhausted and many of the minerals extracted by the plants
>> aren't replenished.
>
> I suppose that it is possible that farmers are overtaxing the soil
> with vegetables, but fruit? It's not like orchards work differently
> today than they always have. It's not like you can rotate tree-based
> crops.
>

Top soil blows away, so when a new orchard is planted, there aren't
as much nutrients in the soil? Not really my area.

>> In addition, fruits and vegetables are being selected for use based
>> on how well they can be shipped and not for taste (how much do you
>> enjoy eating cardboard?) When I lived in California, I loved
>> peaches, plums, strawberries, etc. They tasted sweet. Now I might
>> buy some peaches, but I will go through one or two bins and only
>> find three - if I'm lucky - that smell sweet (like a ripe peach).
>> The others? I don't even bother.
>
> The difference is that in California you were probably buying tree or
> vine-ripened fruit while in other parts of the country you were almost
> certainly buying fruits and vegetables that were picked early and
> allowed to ripen in transit. There's a big difference.

I have the same problem when I'm in California.

>
> Chances are good that if you went to your local farmers market (in
> season) you'd be able to get similar tasting fruit.
>

Granted. But the point is that _most_ people buy from stores and the
quality of fruit and vegetables there has declined.

Art

Steve Freides
September 14th 06, 04:38 PM
"Jason Earl" > wrote in message
...
> "Art S" > writes:
>
>> "BradandBrooks" > wrote in message
>> news:[email protected]
>>> Why not just eat a proper diet?
>>>
>>> As someone at military college told me a looong time ago:
>>>
>>> You're forefathers in the special forces, never took vitamins or
>>> creatine. They never took protein powder or anything else. And
>>> they'd kick your ass, left, right and centre. So, why do you bother
>>> to take these things?
>>>
>>> Waste of money.
>>>
>>> Anyone want to respond why vitamins are necessary if you're eating
>>> properly?
>>>
>>> I'm curious.
>>
>> The last I heard, in many cases vegetables and fruit grown today (in
>> the USA) has fewer nutrients than in the past because the soil is
>> getting exhausted and many of the minerals extracted by the plants
>> aren't replenished.
>
> I suppose that it is possible that farmers are overtaxing the soil
> with vegetables, but fruit? It's not like orchards work differently
> today than they always have. It's not like you can rotate tree-based
> crops.
>
>> In addition, fruits and vegetables are being selected for use based
>> on how well they can be shipped and not for taste (how much do you
>> enjoy eating cardboard?) When I lived in California, I loved
>> peaches, plums, strawberries, etc. They tasted sweet. Now I might
>> buy some peaches, but I will go through one or two bins and only
>> find three - if I'm lucky - that smell sweet (like a ripe peach).
>> The others? I don't even bother.
>
> The difference is that in California you were probably buying tree or
> vine-ripened fruit while in other parts of the country you were almost
> certainly buying fruits and vegetables that were picked early and
> allowed to ripen in transit. There's a big difference.
>
> Chances are good that if you went to your local farmers market (in
> season) you'd be able to get similar tasting fruit.

We have a farmers market here in my town on Sundays during the warmer
months. My wife says the difference in the quality of the vegetables is
very easy to notice. Her observation - buy from the cheaper grocery
store in town and the veggies go bad in a day or two, buy from the more
expensive grocery store in town and they last a few days longer, buy
from the farmers market and they last all week until the next farmers
market. We (read: mw wife) grow a few things next to the house, too,
and there's nothing quite like fresh food. For one, it needs much less
in the way of salt and sweeteners to make it taste good.

-S-
http://www.kbnj.com

September 14th 06, 04:54 PM
David Cohen wrote:
> > wrote
> > Hi Larry,
> > I know a lot of vitamins out there are crap and do not absorb well in
> > the body.
>
> References, please.
>
> > The best vitamins are made from whole food, such as Nikken
> > (the best).
>
> References, please.
>
> > If you want to know if Kirkland vitamins are good, put one
> > vitamin in white vinegar to see if it dissolves. White vinegar is
> > about the same make up of your stomach acid which is why this will
> > work. If it doesn't dissolve, you have your answer. If it takes too
> > long to dissolve (more than 3 minutes) it may not be good either.
>
> Yeah, because most people have a 3 minute gastric transit time.
>
> > If
> > it dissolves too fast that isn't good (1 min or less).
>
> References, please.
>
> > A lot to this
> > but try it out for yourself and see if Kirkland is good. Hope this
> > helps.
>
> Oh, I'm sure it does. Larry was in need of a good laugh. You have truly
> helped.
>
> > Ben Warstler
> > Build Better Athletes
>
> You build them with Legos, don't you?
>
> Thought so.
>
> David

September 14th 06, 05:00 PM
Jason Earl wrote:
> "David Cohen" > writes:
>
> > > wrote
> >> Hi Larry, I know a lot of vitamins out there are crap and do not
> >> absorb well in the body.
> >
> > References, please.
> >
> >> The best vitamins are made from whole food, such as Nikken (the
> >> best).
> >
> > References, please.
>
> I didn't want to say anything, but now I can't help but pile on here.
> I have a family member that is always trying to sell me some Nikken
> stuff and so I have looked into their "products." I have a hard time
> getting excited about any company's "fitness" products that would try
> and sell me expensive weighted shoes as an alternative to exercise.
>
> http://www.nikken.com/index.cfm?fuse=prod1&prod_id=1910
> >Do you currently exercise? This is more for people who do not have the time to
exercise or are starting to exercise. I have a pair and use them when
I train my wife. We do part of her workout with the shoes. Not
everybody is going to be able to jump into a full fledged fitness
program.

> >> If you want to know if Kirkland vitamins are good, put one vitamin
> >> in white vinegar to see if it dissolves. White vinegar is about
> >> the same make up of your stomach acid which is why this will work.
> >> If it doesn't dissolve, you have your answer. If it takes too long
> >> to dissolve (more than 3 minutes) it may not be good either.
> >
> > Yeah, because most people have a 3 minute gastric transit time.
>
> So how would *you* judge whether a vitamin is good or not. I
> currently am taking (I kid you not) Flintstone's Chewables because my
> kids won't eat them and I am too cheap to throw them away. When those
> are gone I will probably buy the Kirkland brand vitamins because I
> like shopping at Costco, and I like the Kirkland brand.

>>I would suggest looking for pharmaceutical grade vitamins. Obviously, anything made from whole food is going to be better than manufactured nutrition.
>
> If I had any idea what they put in a "good" vitamin I would compare
> myself, but I don't really have an idea as to what constitutes a good
> multivitamin. Chances are fair that Kirkland's vitamins will be "good
> enough" for me, but I'm always curious.
>
> >> If it dissolves too fast that isn't good (1 min or less).
> >
> > References, please.
> >
> >> A lot to this but try it out for yourself and see if Kirkland is
> >> good. Hope this helps.
> >
> > Oh, I'm sure it does. Larry was in need of a good laugh. You have
> > truly helped.
>
> Jason

September 14th 06, 05:08 PM
Hey David: Maybe this will help

http://www1.5pillars.com//nutritionalsupplement.cfm?SRID=1

David Cohen wrote:
> > wrote
> > Hi Larry,
> > I know a lot of vitamins out there are crap and do not absorb well in
> > the body.
>
> References, please.
>
> > The best vitamins are made from whole food, such as Nikken
> > (the best).
>
> References, please.
>
> > If you want to know if Kirkland vitamins are good, put one
> > vitamin in white vinegar to see if it dissolves. White vinegar is
> > about the same make up of your stomach acid which is why this will
> > work. If it doesn't dissolve, you have your answer. If it takes too
> > long to dissolve (more than 3 minutes) it may not be good either.
>
> Yeah, because most people have a 3 minute gastric transit time.
>
> > If
> > it dissolves too fast that isn't good (1 min or less).
>
> References, please.
>
> > A lot to this
> > but try it out for yourself and see if Kirkland is good. Hope this
> > helps.
>
> Oh, I'm sure it does. Larry was in need of a good laugh. You have truly
> helped.
>
> > Ben Warstler
> > Build Better Athletes
>
> You build them with Legos, don't you?
>
> Thought so.
>
> David

September 14th 06, 05:10 PM
Hey David: Maybe this will help

http://www1.5pillars.com//nutritionalsupplement.cfm?SRID=1

David Cohen wrote:
> > wrote
> > Hi Larry,
> > I know a lot of vitamins out there are crap and do not absorb well in
> > the body.
>
> References, please.
>
> > The best vitamins are made from whole food, such as Nikken
> > (the best).
>
> References, please.
>
> > If you want to know if Kirkland vitamins are good, put one
> > vitamin in white vinegar to see if it dissolves. White vinegar is
> > about the same make up of your stomach acid which is why this will
> > work. If it doesn't dissolve, you have your answer. If it takes too
> > long to dissolve (more than 3 minutes) it may not be good either.
>
> Yeah, because most people have a 3 minute gastric transit time.
>
> > If
> > it dissolves too fast that isn't good (1 min or less).
>
> References, please.
>
> > A lot to this
> > but try it out for yourself and see if Kirkland is good. Hope this
> > helps.
>
> Oh, I'm sure it does. Larry was in need of a good laugh. You have truly
> helped.
>
> > Ben Warstler
> > Build Better Athletes
>
> You build them with Legos, don't you?
>
> Thought so.
>
> David

David Cohen
September 14th 06, 06:02 PM
> wrote
> Hey David: Maybe this will help
>
> http://www1.5pillars.com//nutritionalsupplement.cfm?SRID=1

Hey Ben: No actually it didn't address any of your claims. Unless I missed
it. I went through most of the site. Would you care to provide a specific
link to any specific support of any of your claims, or can we just say, "Ben
was trying to bull**** us, and failed, but, we'll forgive him, 'cause he's
buying the beer and pizza when we all come over to his place this weekend"?

David
>
> David Cohen wrote:
>> > wrote
>> > Hi Larry,
>> > I know a lot of vitamins out there are crap and do not absorb well in
>> > the body.
>>
>> References, please.
>>
>> > The best vitamins are made from whole food, such as Nikken
>> > (the best).
>>
>> References, please.
>>
>> > If you want to know if Kirkland vitamins are good, put one
>> > vitamin in white vinegar to see if it dissolves. White vinegar is
>> > about the same make up of your stomach acid which is why this will
>> > work. If it doesn't dissolve, you have your answer. If it takes too
>> > long to dissolve (more than 3 minutes) it may not be good either.
>>
>> Yeah, because most people have a 3 minute gastric transit time.
>>
>> > If
>> > it dissolves too fast that isn't good (1 min or less).
>>
>> References, please.
>>
>> > A lot to this
>> > but try it out for yourself and see if Kirkland is good. Hope this
>> > helps.
>>
>> Oh, I'm sure it does. Larry was in need of a good laugh. You have truly
>> helped.
>>
>> > Ben Warstler
>> > Build Better Athletes
>>
>> You build them with Legos, don't you?
>>
>> Thought so.
>>
>> David
>

Jason Earl
September 14th 06, 07:43 PM
writes:

> Jason Earl wrote:
>> "David Cohen" > writes:
>>
>> > > wrote
>>
>> I didn't want to say anything, but now I can't help but pile on
>> here. I have a family member that is always trying to sell me some
>> Nikken stuff and so I have looked into their "products." I have a
>> hard time getting excited about any company's "fitness" products
>> that would try and sell me expensive weighted shoes as an
>> alternative to exercise.
>>
>> http://www.nikken.com/index.cfm?fuse=prod1&prod_id=1910
>
> Do you currently exercise? This is more for people who do not have
> the time to exercise or are starting to exercise. I have a pair and
> use them when I train my wife. We do part of her workout with the
> shoes. Not everybody is going to be able to jump into a full
> fledged fitness program.

*If* I thought that weighted shoes were a good idea (they are not, for
a variety of reasons) then there are far better ways to achieve the
same result. For example, for a few bucks you can get ankle weights.

If time is truly a factor, then I would suggest Tabata sprints. The
entire workout takes 4 minutes. Alternatively you can spend $15,000
and get the ROM machine.

BTW David, the DVD finally came in the mail. Now I am on their *@#!!
mailing list.

Jason

September 14th 06, 07:50 PM
I suggest you take a closer look at the shoes. They are nothing like
ankle weights as ankle weights are detrimental to your joints because
of the positioning on your ankle and where the weightis distributed.
The ergonomic design of these shoes place the weight in a safe place.
Besides with over 40 million satisfied customers and if people were
getting hurt using the shoes, don't you think it would be all over the
internet. Bad news travels very fast as you probably already know.
I'm not looking to argue a point. I'm only trying to educate. There
are a lot of misconceptions.

I appreciate your comments.

Jason Earl wrote:
> writes:
>
> > Jason Earl wrote:
> >> "David Cohen" > writes:
> >>
> >> > > wrote
> >>
> >> I didn't want to say anything, but now I can't help but pile on
> >> here. I have a family member that is always trying to sell me some
> >> Nikken stuff and so I have looked into their "products." I have a
> >> hard time getting excited about any company's "fitness" products
> >> that would try and sell me expensive weighted shoes as an
> >> alternative to exercise.
> >>
> >> http://www.nikken.com/index.cfm?fuse=prod1&prod_id=1910
> >
> > Do you currently exercise? This is more for people who do not have
> > the time to exercise or are starting to exercise. I have a pair and
> > use them when I train my wife. We do part of her workout with the
> > shoes. Not everybody is going to be able to jump into a full
> > fledged fitness program.
>
> *If* I thought that weighted shoes were a good idea (they are not, for
> a variety of reasons) then there are far better ways to achieve the
> same result. For example, for a few bucks you can get ankle weights.
>
> If time is truly a factor, then I would suggest Tabata sprints. The
> entire workout takes 4 minutes. Alternatively you can spend $15,000
> and get the ROM machine.
>
> BTW David, the DVD finally came in the mail. Now I am on their *@#!!
> mailing list.
>
> Jason

Jason Earl
September 14th 06, 08:09 PM
writes:

> I suggest you take a closer look at the shoes. They are nothing
> like ankle weights as ankle weights are detrimental to your joints
> because of the positioning on your ankle and where the weightis
> distributed.

I've seen the shoes, and the difference between the shoes and ankle
weights is that the shoes are also a trip hazard. Feel free to like
them if you want. If I want heavy shoes I will put on my work boots
or some waders. For the ultimate workout I could put on my workboots
*and* some waders.

Then I will do some jumping jacks.

> The ergonomic design of these shoes place the weight in a safe
> place.

The shoes I have seen had like a 2.5 inch sole. That's hardly optimal
for shoes that you are supposed to work out in. Perhaps the newer
shoes are better, but either way it is a stupid idea ridiculously
executed.

> Besides with over 40 million satisfied customers and if people were
> getting hurt using the shoes, don't you think it would be all over
> the internet.

Oh really, just this weekend my wife's uncle pitched down a hill
collecting pine nuts with me wearing these monstrosities. You didn't
hear from him because he's convinced the shoes are magical. Well
done, Nikken...

> Bad news travels very fast as you probably already know. I'm not
> looking to argue a point. I'm only trying to educate. There are a
> lot of misconceptions.
>
> I appreciate your comments.

Generally speaking I don't like to unload on products. If it makes
people happy to buy unwieldy shoes, that's their business. However,
anyone pretending that these shoes are in any way shape or form
beneficial is completely insane.

Jason

September 14th 06, 08:19 PM
I appreciate your comments as I said. I'm sorry your wife's uncle
believes the shoes are
magical because they are not. I do like your idea about the workboots
and waders though. Why not add some stairs into it followed by some
sled pulling, then finish with some pistols.
Are weighted vests insane too?

Jason Earl wrote:
> writes:
>
> > I suggest you take a closer look at the shoes. They are nothing
> > like ankle weights as ankle weights are detrimental to your joints
> > because of the positioning on your ankle and where the weightis
> > distributed.
>
> I've seen the shoes, and the difference between the shoes and ankle
> weights is that the shoes are also a trip hazard. Feel free to like
> them if you want. If I want heavy shoes I will put on my work boots
> or some waders. For the ultimate workout I could put on my workboots
> *and* some waders.
>
> Then I will do some jumping jacks.
>
> > The ergonomic design of these shoes place the weight in a safe
> > place.
>
> The shoes I have seen had like a 2.5 inch sole. That's hardly optimal
> for shoes that you are supposed to work out in. Perhaps the newer
> shoes are better, but either way it is a stupid idea ridiculously
> executed.
>
> > Besides with over 40 million satisfied customers and if people were
> > getting hurt using the shoes, don't you think it would be all over
> > the internet.
>
> Oh really, just this weekend my wife's uncle pitched down a hill
> collecting pine nuts with me wearing these monstrosities. You didn't
> hear from him because he's convinced the shoes are magical. Well
> done, Nikken...
>
> > Bad news travels very fast as you probably already know. I'm not
> > looking to argue a point. I'm only trying to educate. There are a
> > lot of misconceptions.
> >
> > I appreciate your comments.
>
> Generally speaking I don't like to unload on products. If it makes
> people happy to buy unwieldy shoes, that's their business. However,
> anyone pretending that these shoes are in any way shape or form
> beneficial is completely insane.
>
> Jason

Jason Earl
September 14th 06, 08:46 PM
writes:

> I appreciate your comments as I said. I'm sorry your wife's uncle
> believes the shoes are magical because they are not. I do like your
> idea about the workboots and waders though. Why not add some stairs
> into it followed by some sled pulling, then finish with some
> pistols. Are weighted vests insane too?

First of all, I am going to start by apologizing a bit. My wife's
aunt and uncle are nice, but they are a little kooky about this stuff.
They are constantly trying to get me interested in health devices that
seem to be centered around magnetism. To be honest, I could have
sworn that my relatives were wearing the shoes because they had heavy
*magnets* in them, not simply because they were weighted shoes. Some
of that has apparently rubbed off on you, and that's unfortunate.

For all I know the Nikken shoes represent a safe and comfortable way
to add a little bit of difficulty to your daily chores. And as for
the shoes being a trip hazard, well, half the shoes that my wife wears
are at least as dangerous, so I suppose that I can't hardly blame
Nikken if their shoes are not 100% offroad functional.

From experience workboots and waders are a great way to get in a
ridiculously hard workout. For maximum benefit wade around in some
sticky mud for most of a day. Once, as a kid, I was stuck for several
hours. When I finally managed to free myself I could barely walk up
the hill to my house.

I also am in favor of stairs and sled pulling. Wheelbarrows are nice
too. I've never owned or used a weighted vest, but I previously
weighed an extra 40 lbs. Climbing hills at 260+ lbs. a good way to
build your calf muscles. Some day I am going to get me a weighted
vest so that I can remember what jogging with all that extra weight
was like. The added weight didn't kill my knees then, I'm confident
that they would be up for the occasional jog down memory lane.

My bad.

Jason

September 14th 06, 09:04 PM
Jason,
Do you currently have an exercise regimen that you follow? It sounds
like you want to
lose some weight. I don't think either of us are at fault for stating
our opinions, we are both entitled to that at least. I encounter
people that have stiff opinions about Nikken all the time. I think
really it is because people haven't seen stuff like this before and are
taken aback by it and immediately label it. Anyway, I could go on and
on, but for the sake of everyone reading these and yourself Jason, I
will shut my trap!! Funny how this whole thing started with finding
out if Kirkland vitamins are good for you!

Ben

Jason Earl wrote:
> writes:
>
> > I appreciate your comments as I said. I'm sorry your wife's uncle
> > believes the shoes are magical because they are not. I do like your
> > idea about the workboots and waders though. Why not add some stairs
> > into it followed by some sled pulling, then finish with some
> > pistols. Are weighted vests insane too?
>
> First of all, I am going to start by apologizing a bit. My wife's
> aunt and uncle are nice, but they are a little kooky about this stuff.
> They are constantly trying to get me interested in health devices that
> seem to be centered around magnetism. To be honest, I could have
> sworn that my relatives were wearing the shoes because they had heavy
> *magnets* in them, not simply because they were weighted shoes. Some
> of that has apparently rubbed off on you, and that's unfortunate.
>
> For all I know the Nikken shoes represent a safe and comfortable way
> to add a little bit of difficulty to your daily chores. And as for
> the shoes being a trip hazard, well, half the shoes that my wife wears
> are at least as dangerous, so I suppose that I can't hardly blame
> Nikken if their shoes are not 100% offroad functional.
>
> From experience workboots and waders are a great way to get in a
> ridiculously hard workout. For maximum benefit wade around in some
> sticky mud for most of a day. Once, as a kid, I was stuck for several
> hours. When I finally managed to free myself I could barely walk up
> the hill to my house.
>
> I also am in favor of stairs and sled pulling. Wheelbarrows are nice
> too. I've never owned or used a weighted vest, but I previously
> weighed an extra 40 lbs. Climbing hills at 260+ lbs. a good way to
> build your calf muscles. Some day I am going to get me a weighted
> vest so that I can remember what jogging with all that extra weight
> was like. The added weight didn't kill my knees then, I'm confident
> that they would be up for the occasional jog down memory lane.
>
> My bad.
>
> Jason

September 14th 06, 09:05 PM
Jason,
Do you currently have an exercise regimen that you follow? It sounds
like you want to
lose some weight. I don't think either of us are at fault for stating
our opinions, we are both entitled to that at least. I encounter
people that have stiff opinions about Nikken all the time. I think
really it is because people haven't seen stuff like this before and are
taken aback by it and immediately label it. Anyway, I could go on and
on, but for the sake of everyone reading these and yourself Jason, I
will shut my trap!! Funny how this whole thing started with finding
out if Kirkland vitamins are good for you!

Ben

Jason Earl wrote:
> writes:
>
> > I appreciate your comments as I said. I'm sorry your wife's uncle
> > believes the shoes are magical because they are not. I do like your
> > idea about the workboots and waders though. Why not add some stairs
> > into it followed by some sled pulling, then finish with some
> > pistols. Are weighted vests insane too?
>
> First of all, I am going to start by apologizing a bit. My wife's
> aunt and uncle are nice, but they are a little kooky about this stuff.
> They are constantly trying to get me interested in health devices that
> seem to be centered around magnetism. To be honest, I could have
> sworn that my relatives were wearing the shoes because they had heavy
> *magnets* in them, not simply because they were weighted shoes. Some
> of that has apparently rubbed off on you, and that's unfortunate.
>
> For all I know the Nikken shoes represent a safe and comfortable way
> to add a little bit of difficulty to your daily chores. And as for
> the shoes being a trip hazard, well, half the shoes that my wife wears
> are at least as dangerous, so I suppose that I can't hardly blame
> Nikken if their shoes are not 100% offroad functional.
>
> From experience workboots and waders are a great way to get in a
> ridiculously hard workout. For maximum benefit wade around in some
> sticky mud for most of a day. Once, as a kid, I was stuck for several
> hours. When I finally managed to free myself I could barely walk up
> the hill to my house.
>
> I also am in favor of stairs and sled pulling. Wheelbarrows are nice
> too. I've never owned or used a weighted vest, but I previously
> weighed an extra 40 lbs. Climbing hills at 260+ lbs. a good way to
> build your calf muscles. Some day I am going to get me a weighted
> vest so that I can remember what jogging with all that extra weight
> was like. The added weight didn't kill my knees then, I'm confident
> that they would be up for the occasional jog down memory lane.
>
> My bad.
>
> Jason

David Cohen
September 14th 06, 09:17 PM
"Jason Earl" > wrote
> writes:
>> Jason Earl wrote:
>>> "David Cohen" > writes:
>>> > > wrote
>>>
>>> I didn't want to say anything, but now I can't help but pile on
>>> here. I have a family member that is always trying to sell me some
>>> Nikken stuff and so I have looked into their "products." I have a
>>> hard time getting excited about any company's "fitness" products
>>> that would try and sell me expensive weighted shoes as an
>>> alternative to exercise.
>>>
>>> http://www.nikken.com/index.cfm?fuse=prod1&prod_id=1910
>>
>> Do you currently exercise? This is more for people who do not have
>> the time to exercise or are starting to exercise. I have a pair and
>> use them when I train my wife. We do part of her workout with the
>> shoes. Not everybody is going to be able to jump into a full
>> fledged fitness program.
>
> *If* I thought that weighted shoes were a good idea (they are not, for
> a variety of reasons) then there are far better ways to achieve the
> same result. For example, for a few bucks you can get ankle weights.
>
> If time is truly a factor, then I would suggest Tabata sprints. The
> entire workout takes 4 minutes. Alternatively you can spend $15,000
> and get the ROM machine.
>
> BTW David, the DVD finally came in the mail. Now I am on their *@#!!
> mailing list.

Excellent! Now you're on my second tier list, and I get a payment each time
they sell your information.

Let's see, 5 second tier, 16 third tier...uh, could you get a few of your
friends and relatives to send for the DVD, maybe...damn, they were right, I
can retire in five months, working from home!

David

Jason Earl
September 14th 06, 11:48 PM
"David Cohen" > writes:

> "Jason Earl" > wrote
>> writes:
>>> Jason Earl wrote:
>>>> "David Cohen" > writes:
>>>> > > wrote
>>>>
>>>> I didn't want to say anything, but now I can't help but pile on
>>>> here. I have a family member that is always trying to sell me some
>>>> Nikken stuff and so I have looked into their "products." I have a
>>>> hard time getting excited about any company's "fitness" products
>>>> that would try and sell me expensive weighted shoes as an
>>>> alternative to exercise.
>>>>
>>>> http://www.nikken.com/index.cfm?fuse=prod1&prod_id=1910
>>>
>>> Do you currently exercise? This is more for people who do not have
>>> the time to exercise or are starting to exercise. I have a pair and
>>> use them when I train my wife. We do part of her workout with the
>>> shoes. Not everybody is going to be able to jump into a full
>>> fledged fitness program.
>>
>> *If* I thought that weighted shoes were a good idea (they are not, for
>> a variety of reasons) then there are far better ways to achieve the
>> same result. For example, for a few bucks you can get ankle weights.
>>
>> If time is truly a factor, then I would suggest Tabata sprints. The
>> entire workout takes 4 minutes. Alternatively you can spend $15,000
>> and get the ROM machine.
>>
>> BTW David, the DVD finally came in the mail. Now I am on their *@#!!
>> mailing list.
>
> Excellent! Now you're on my second tier list, and I get a payment
> each time they sell your information.
>
> Let's see, 5 second tier, 16 third tier...uh, could you get a few of
> your friends and relatives to send for the DVD, maybe...damn, they
> were right, I can retire in five months, working from home!

If it's that easy then maybe I should get in on the deal. I've got
lots and lots of relatives.

Jason

JMW
September 15th 06, 03:13 AM
Jason Earl > wrote:

writes:
>>
>> The ergonomic design of these shoes place the weight in a safe
>> place.
>
>The shoes I have seen had like a 2.5 inch sole. That's hardly optimal
>for shoes that you are supposed to work out in. Perhaps the newer
>shoes are better, but either way it is a stupid idea ridiculously
>executed.
>
>> Besides with over 40 million satisfied customers and if people were
>> getting hurt using the shoes, don't you think it would be all over
>> the internet.
>
>Oh really, just this weekend my wife's uncle pitched down a hill
>collecting pine nuts with me wearing these monstrosities. You didn't
>hear from him because he's convinced the shoes are magical. Well
>done, Nikken...

I heard the damn things killed Bill Davidson's brother-in-law.

Jason Earl
September 15th 06, 03:29 AM
JMW > writes:

> Jason Earl > wrote:
>
writes:
>>> Besides with over 40 million satisfied customers and if people
>>> were getting hurt using the shoes, don't you think it would be all
>>> over the internet.
>>
>>Oh really, just this weekend my wife's uncle pitched down a hill
>>collecting pine nuts with me wearing these monstrosities. You
>>didn't hear from him because he's convinced the shoes are magical.
>>Well done, Nikken...
>
> I heard the damn things killed Bill Davidson's brother-in-law.

I'm sure TBR's brother-in-law committed suicide. So would you if he
was part of your "family." Or is Bill Davidson someone else? I get
confused by some of the aliases.

That being the case, the above-mentioned Nikken incident really did
happen, and it triggered yet another discussion with my favorite set
of witch doctors. I could have held off of the Nikken-bashing, but
Cohen jumped in first. Once I got started I didn't really know where
to stop...

Balance seems like a nice enough individual. I probably shouldn't
have unloaded on him like that. His goofy shoes are no worse than my
kettlebell (ok, maybe a little worse), and they almost certainly cost
less :).

Jason