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View Full Version : OT - Hussein Captured in Iraq


Bill
December 14th 03, 07:42 AM
> > >>>This is the greatest news and rivals even England's winning of the
> > >>>Rugby World Cup.

It means about as much as a sports event except to those who have to dodge
IED's or to those who ultimately have to pay the enormous cost of the
effort.

> > >>>I hope this marks the beginning of the end of our involvement in that
> > >>>troubled region.

A lot of Iraqis and other Arabs feel badly that the US had to find him.
They do not want our involvement either.

> > Cool, but not ALL arabs or all Moslems (and there is a difference here),
> > started this ****.

British and US meddling goes back generations. Osama and the Taliban were
part of the USCIA effort to encourage "terrorism" against the USSR in
Afghanistan, e.g.

We have met the enemy, and "they is us"

Howard Garland
December 14th 03, 03:04 PM
Great news this morning. No matter how I feel about US presence in Iraq,
it's great to know that the career of this ****head thug is over.

Howie - who's going have a little extra energy doing those pullups today.

Bill K
December 14th 03, 03:16 PM
"Howard Garland" > wrote in message
...
> Great news this morning. No matter how I feel about US presence in Iraq,
> it's great to know that the career of this ****head thug is over.

Roger that!

But the one I really want is Bin Laden....



Bill K.

Scoot
December 14th 03, 03:25 PM
great, that's good to hear. Now I guess we can stop looking for Bin Laden and
the folks responsible for flying jets into the WTC, the Pentagon, as well as
the jet the passengers attempted to retake. We'll take the straw man instead
of those actually responsible for 3000 deaths.

Way to fail gang..


Scoot
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~
If you find a posting or message from myself offensive, inappropriate, or
disruptive, please ignore it. If you don't know how to ignore a posting,
complain to me and I will demonstrate.

Dally
December 14th 03, 03:37 PM
Scoot wrote:

> great, that's good to hear. Now I guess we can stop looking for Bin Laden and
> the folks responsible for flying jets into the WTC, the Pentagon, as well as
> the jet the passengers attempted to retake. We'll take the straw man instead
> of those actually responsible for 3000 deaths.
>
> Way to fail gang..

Shhh! Bush will hear you and have to come up with another way to
deflect our attention from the fact that we haven't caught Bin Laden.
There are more bad guys out there, you know. (And I don't want to have
to start a war with Korea just to keep Bush's ratings high.)

I was going to say that every civics class should be required to see the
movie "Wag the Dog", but I doubt anyone actually takes civics classes
anymore.

Dally

Howard Garland
December 14th 03, 03:47 PM
Scoot wrote:

> great, that's good to hear. Now I guess we can stop looking for Bin Laden and
> the folks responsible for flying jets into the WTC, the Pentagon, as well as
> the jet the passengers attempted to retake. We'll take the straw man instead
> of those actually responsible for 3000 deaths.

Nah! Didn't say that and don't believe Hussein had anything to do with
9/11. I just think it's nice that the ****head was found.

Howie

>
> Way to fail gang..


>
>
> Scoot
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~
> If you find a posting or message from myself offensive, inappropriate, or
> disruptive, please ignore it. If you don't know how to ignore a posting,
> complain to me and I will demonstrate.
>

JC Der Koenig
December 14th 03, 05:15 PM
"Scoot" > wrote in message
...
> great, that's good to hear. Now I guess we can stop looking for Bin Laden
and
> the folks responsible for flying jets into the WTC, the Pentagon, as well
as
> the jet the passengers attempted to retake. We'll take the straw man
instead
> of those actually responsible for 3000 deaths.
>
> Way to fail gang..
>
>

The best way to fix the problem would be to kill all arabs and muslims.
Let's get started.

Scoot
December 14th 03, 05:18 PM
>
>
>The best way to fix the problem would be to kill all arabs and muslims.
>Let's get started.
>
>
>

Good idea. Then George W. Bush will have won his terrorist attack to take
control of the mid-east oil fields....


Scoot
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~
If you find a posting or message from myself offensive, inappropriate, or
disruptive, please ignore it. If you don't know how to ignore a posting,
complain to me and I will demonstrate.

John HUDSON
December 14th 03, 05:19 PM
On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 10:04:19 -0500, Howard Garland
> wrote:

>Great news this morning. No matter how I feel about US presence in Iraq,
> it's great to know that the career of this ****head thug is over.
>

This is the greatest news and rivals even England's winning of the
Rugby World Cup.

I hope this marks the beginning of the end of our involvement in that
troubled region.

>Howie - who's going have a little extra energy doing those pullups today.

John HUDSON
December 14th 03, 05:27 PM
On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 17:15:43 GMT, "JC Der Koenig"
> wrote:

>"Scoot" > wrote in message
...
>> great, that's good to hear. Now I guess we can stop looking for Bin Laden
>and
>> the folks responsible for flying jets into the WTC, the Pentagon, as well
>as
>> the jet the passengers attempted to retake. We'll take the straw man
>instead
>> of those actually responsible for 3000 deaths.
>>
>> Way to fail gang..
>>
>>
>
>The best way to fix the problem would be to kill all arabs and muslims.
>Let's get started.

It's very tempting but a tad over the top! ;o)

>

JC Der Koenig
December 14th 03, 05:31 PM
"John HUDSON" > wrote in message
...
> On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 17:15:43 GMT, "JC Der Koenig"
> > wrote:
>
> >"Scoot" > wrote in message
> ...
> >> great, that's good to hear. Now I guess we can stop looking for Bin
Laden
> >and
> >> the folks responsible for flying jets into the WTC, the Pentagon, as
well
> >as
> >> the jet the passengers attempted to retake. We'll take the straw man
> >instead
> >> of those actually responsible for 3000 deaths.
> >>
> >> Way to fail gang..
> >>
> >>
> >
> >The best way to fix the problem would be to kill all arabs and muslims.
> >Let's get started.
>
> It's very tempting but a tad over the top! ;o)
>
> >
>

The main problem with the plan is that there are too many British and
American citizens that are muslim. Damn Magna Carta.

John HUDSON
December 14th 03, 05:43 PM
On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 17:31:15 GMT, "JC Der Koenig"
> wrote:

>"John HUDSON" > wrote in message
...
>> On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 17:15:43 GMT, "JC Der Koenig"
>> > wrote:
>>
>> >"Scoot" > wrote in message
>> ...
>> >> great, that's good to hear. Now I guess we can stop looking for Bin
>Laden
>> >and
>> >> the folks responsible for flying jets into the WTC, the Pentagon, as
>well
>> >as
>> >> the jet the passengers attempted to retake. We'll take the straw man
>> >instead
>> >> of those actually responsible for 3000 deaths.
>> >>
>> >> Way to fail gang..
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> >The best way to fix the problem would be to kill all arabs and muslims.
>> >Let's get started.
>>
>> It's very tempting but a tad over the top! ;o)
>>
>> >
>>
>
>The main problem with the plan is that there are too many British and
>American citizens that are muslim. Damn Magna Carta.

Magna Carta intended that a domiciled national would owe first
allegiance to the nation. King Richard did his best to make that point
during the crusades.

It's the contemporary interpretation by the wooly-minded that present
us with our current dilemma.

If they are not for us then they are against us, and should be treated
accordingly.

>

JC Der Koenig
December 14th 03, 05:46 PM
"John HUDSON" > wrote in message
...
> On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 17:31:15 GMT, "JC Der Koenig"
> > wrote:
>
> >"John HUDSON" > wrote in message
> ...
> >> On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 17:15:43 GMT, "JC Der Koenig"
> >> > wrote:
> >>
> >> >"Scoot" > wrote in message
> >> ...
> >> >> great, that's good to hear. Now I guess we can stop looking for Bin
> >Laden
> >> >and
> >> >> the folks responsible for flying jets into the WTC, the Pentagon, as
> >well
> >> >as
> >> >> the jet the passengers attempted to retake. We'll take the straw
man
> >> >instead
> >> >> of those actually responsible for 3000 deaths.
> >> >>
> >> >> Way to fail gang..
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >
> >> >The best way to fix the problem would be to kill all arabs and
muslims.
> >> >Let's get started.
> >>
> >> It's very tempting but a tad over the top! ;o)
> >>
> >> >
> >>
> >
> >The main problem with the plan is that there are too many British and
> >American citizens that are muslim. Damn Magna Carta.
>
> Magna Carta intended that a domiciled national would owe first
> allegiance to the nation. King Richard did his best to make that point
> during the crusades.
>
> It's the contemporary interpretation by the wooly-minded that present
> us with our current dilemma.
>
> If they are not for us then they are against us, and should be treated
> accordingly.
>

Amazingly, for once, I agree with you.

John HUDSON
December 14th 03, 05:51 PM
On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 17:46:26 GMT, "JC Der Koenig"
> wrote:

>"John HUDSON" > wrote in message
...
>> On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 17:31:15 GMT, "JC Der Koenig"
>> > wrote:
>>
>> >"John HUDSON" > wrote in message
>> ...
>> >> On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 17:15:43 GMT, "JC Der Koenig"
>> >> > wrote:
>> >>
>> >> >"Scoot" > wrote in message
>> >> ...
>> >> >> great, that's good to hear. Now I guess we can stop looking for Bin
>> >Laden
>> >> >and
>> >> >> the folks responsible for flying jets into the WTC, the Pentagon, as
>> >well
>> >> >as
>> >> >> the jet the passengers attempted to retake. We'll take the straw
>man
>> >> >instead
>> >> >> of those actually responsible for 3000 deaths.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Way to fail gang..
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >
>> >> >The best way to fix the problem would be to kill all arabs and
>muslims.
>> >> >Let's get started.
>> >>
>> >> It's very tempting but a tad over the top! ;o)
>> >>
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >
>> >The main problem with the plan is that there are too many British and
>> >American citizens that are muslim. Damn Magna Carta.
>>
>> Magna Carta intended that a domiciled national would owe first
>> allegiance to the nation. King Richard did his best to make that point
>> during the crusades.
>>
>> It's the contemporary interpretation by the wooly-minded that present
>> us with our current dilemma.
>>
>> If they are not for us then they are against us, and should be treated
>> accordingly.
>>
>
>Amazingly, for once, I agree with you.

We are making enormous progress towards trans-Atlantic tolerance and
understanding JC! ;o)

>

DRS
December 14th 03, 05:51 PM
John HUDSON > wrote in message


[...]

> If they are not for us then they are against us, and should be treated
> accordingly.

Er, no. Geopolitics is rarely if ever so simplistic or simple-minded, there
being more than one way to skin a cat, etc...

--

"Posting at the top because that's where the cursor happened to be is like
****ting in your pants because that's where your asshole happened to be."
Andreas Prilop

Dally
December 14th 03, 05:54 PM
John HUDSON wrote:

> We are making enormous progress towards trans-Atlantic tolerance and
> understanding JC! ;o)

I suppose it makes a difference where you mean by trans-Atlantic.

Dally, who notes the middle East is on that side of the Pond

JC Der Koenig
December 14th 03, 05:54 PM
The shortest way between two points is a straight line. Very simple.

--
JC

"DRS" > wrote in message
...
> John HUDSON > wrote in message
>
>
> [...]
>
> > If they are not for us then they are against us, and should be treated
> > accordingly.
>
> Er, no. Geopolitics is rarely if ever so simplistic or simple-minded,
there
> being more than one way to skin a cat, etc...
>
> --
>
> "Posting at the top because that's where the cursor happened to be is like
> ****ting in your pants because that's where your asshole happened to be."
> Andreas Prilop
>
>

Howard Garland
December 14th 03, 05:57 PM
John HUDSON wrote:

> On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 10:04:19 -0500, Howard Garland
> > wrote:
>
>
>>Great news this morning. No matter how I feel about US presence in Iraq,
>> it's great to know that the career of this ****head thug is over.
>>
>
>
> This is the greatest news and rivals even England's winning of the
> Rugby World Cup.
>
> I hope this marks the beginning of the end of our involvement in that
> troubled region.
>
>
>>Howie - who's going have a little extra energy doing those pullups today.

I with you, John; but some of those posts above are making me sorry that
I started this ****ing thread.

Howie - who is not fond of killing anyone (even in jest) because of
their race, religion, or ethnicity.

DRS
December 14th 03, 05:58 PM
JC Der Koenig > wrote in message

> The shortest way between two points is a straight line. Very simple.

Only if the universe is flat, which it isn't. And stop top-posting.

--

"Posting at the top because that's where the cursor happened to be is like
****ting in your pants because that's where your asshole happened to be."
Andreas Prilop

JC Der Koenig
December 14th 03, 06:00 PM
"Howard Garland" > wrote in message
...
> John HUDSON wrote:
>
> > On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 10:04:19 -0500, Howard Garland
> > > wrote:
> >
> >
> >>Great news this morning. No matter how I feel about US presence in Iraq,
> >> it's great to know that the career of this ****head thug is over.
> >>
> >
> >
> > This is the greatest news and rivals even England's winning of the
> > Rugby World Cup.
> >
> > I hope this marks the beginning of the end of our involvement in that
> > troubled region.
> >
> >
> >>Howie - who's going have a little extra energy doing those pullups
today.
>
> I with you, John; but some of those posts above are making me sorry that
> I started this ****ing thread.
>
> Howie - who is not fond of killing anyone (even in jest) because of
> their race, religion, or ethnicity.
>

The Japanese didn't get it, and now the arabs don't get it.

"Don't start no **** and there won't be no ****".

JC Der Koenig
December 14th 03, 06:02 PM
It's good to have an open mind, but not so open that your brains fall out.

--
JC

"DRS" > wrote in message
...
> JC Der Koenig > wrote in message
>
> > The shortest way between two points is a straight line. Very simple.
>
> Only if the universe is flat, which it isn't. And stop top-posting.
>
> --
>
> "Posting at the top because that's where the cursor happened to be is like
> ****ting in your pants because that's where your asshole happened to be."
> Andreas Prilop
>
>

Howard Garland
December 14th 03, 06:17 PM
JC Der Koenig wrote:
> "Howard Garland" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>>John HUDSON wrote:
>>
>>
>>>On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 10:04:19 -0500, Howard Garland
> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>Great news this morning. No matter how I feel about US presence in Iraq,
>>>>it's great to know that the career of this ****head thug is over.
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>This is the greatest news and rivals even England's winning of the
>>>Rugby World Cup.
>>>
>>>I hope this marks the beginning of the end of our involvement in that
>>>troubled region.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>Howie - who's going have a little extra energy doing those pullups
>
> today.
>
>>I with you, John; but some of those posts above are making me sorry that
>>I started this ****ing thread.
>>
>>Howie - who is not fond of killing anyone (even in jest) because of
>>their race, religion, or ethnicity.
>>
>
>
> The Japanese didn't get it, and now the arabs don't get it.
>
> "Don't start no **** and there won't be no ****".

Cool, but not ALL arabs or all Moslems (and there is a difference here),
started this ****. In fact, my guess is that although there's a lot of
Arab (read Saudi) money behind Al Quaeda, most of bin laden's followers
are not "Arab" at all. They are Moslems (who are certainly not ALL
supporters of Al Quaeda). Arabs are people for whom Arabic is the
primaty language. Afgani's are not (for the most part) Arabs. Neither
are Iranians, Bosnians, or Pakastani's.

Howard

JC Der Koenig
December 14th 03, 06:51 PM
"Howard Garland" > wrote in message
...
> JC Der Koenig wrote:
> > "Howard Garland" > wrote in message
> > ...
> >
> >>John HUDSON wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>>On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 10:04:19 -0500, Howard Garland
> > wrote:
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>Great news this morning. No matter how I feel about US presence in
Iraq,
> >>>>it's great to know that the career of this ****head thug is over.
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>This is the greatest news and rivals even England's winning of the
> >>>Rugby World Cup.
> >>>
> >>>I hope this marks the beginning of the end of our involvement in that
> >>>troubled region.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>Howie - who's going have a little extra energy doing those pullups
> >
> > today.
> >
> >>I with you, John; but some of those posts above are making me sorry that
> >>I started this ****ing thread.
> >>
> >>Howie - who is not fond of killing anyone (even in jest) because of
> >>their race, religion, or ethnicity.
> >>
> >
> >
> > The Japanese didn't get it, and now the arabs don't get it.
> >
> > "Don't start no **** and there won't be no ****".
>
> Cool, but not ALL arabs or all Moslems (and there is a difference here),
> started this ****. In fact, my guess is that although there's a lot of
> Arab (read Saudi) money behind Al Quaeda, most of bin laden's followers
> are not "Arab" at all. They are Moslems (who are certainly not ALL
> supporters of Al Quaeda). Arabs are people for whom Arabic is the
> primaty language. Afgani's are not (for the most part) Arabs. Neither
> are Iranians, Bosnians, or Pakastani's.
>
> Howard
>

Not all Germans were Nazis, but that's just the way it goes sometimes.

OmegaZero2003
December 14th 03, 07:41 PM
"DRS" > wrote in message
...
> John HUDSON > wrote in message
>
>
> [...]
>
> > If they are not for us then they are against us, and should be treated
> > accordingly.
>
> Er, no. Geopolitics is rarely if ever so simplistic or simple-minded,
there
> being more than one way to skin a cat, etc...

Hey DRS, where is your answer to the creatine questions designed to see if
you know anything.

>
> --
>
> "Posting at the top because that's where the cursor happened to be is like
> ****ting in your pants because that's where your asshole happened to be."
> Andreas Prilop
>
>

OmegaZero2003
December 14th 03, 07:46 PM
There it is folks, DRS has been to everywhere in the Universe to ascertain
its geometry and to boot, has the insight and mathematical rigor of top
theoretical cosmologists.

In a pig's eye! BWHAHAHAHAHAH!


"DRS" > wrote in message
...
> JC Der Koenig > wrote in message
>
> > The shortest way between two points is a straight line. Very simple.
>
> Only if the universe is flat, which it isn't. And stop top-posting.
>
> --
>
> "Posting at the top because that's where the cursor happened to be is like
> ****ting in your pants because that's where your asshole happened to be."
> Andreas Prilop
>
>

JC Der Koenig
December 14th 03, 07:49 PM
"Bill" > wrote in message
...
> > > >>>This is the greatest news and rivals even England's winning of the
> > > >>>Rugby World Cup.
>
> It means about as much as a sports event except to those who have to dodge
> IED's or to those who ultimately have to pay the enormous cost of the
> effort.
>
> > > >>>I hope this marks the beginning of the end of our involvement in
that
> > > >>>troubled region.
>
> A lot of Iraqis and other Arabs feel badly that the US had to find him.
> They do not want our involvement either.
>
> > > Cool, but not ALL arabs or all Moslems (and there is a difference
here),
> > > started this ****.
>
> British and US meddling goes back generations. Osama and the Taliban were
> part of the USCIA effort to encourage "terrorism" against the USSR in
> Afghanistan, e.g.
>
> We have met the enemy, and "they is us"
>
>

Since you are your own worst enemy: kill yourself.

Donovan Rebbechi
December 14th 03, 08:48 PM
In article >, DRS wrote:
> JC Der Koenig > wrote in message
>
>> The shortest way between two points is a straight line. Very simple.
>
> Only if the universe is flat, which it isn't. And stop top-posting.

Even if the universe isn't flat, it could be (hint: what does "straight" mean?)


--
Donovan Rebbechi
http://pegasus.rutgers.edu/~elflord/

Proton Soup
December 14th 03, 10:23 PM
On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 20:48:49 +0000 (UTC), Donovan Rebbechi
> wrote:

>In article >, DRS wrote:
>> JC Der Koenig > wrote in message
>>
>>> The shortest way between two points is a straight line. Very simple.
>>
>> Only if the universe is flat, which it isn't. And stop top-posting.
>
>Even if the universe isn't flat, it could be (hint: what does "straight" mean?)

It's just a curve of infinite radius.

Proton Soup

Steve
December 14th 03, 10:34 PM
Howard Garland > wrote in message >...
> Great news this morning. No matter how I feel about US presence in Iraq,
> it's great to know that the career of this ****head thug is over.
>
> Howie - who's going have a little extra energy doing those pullups today.

How do you know its him and not one of his doubles?

Steve

Howard Garland
December 14th 03, 10:58 PM
Steve wrote:

> Howard Garland > wrote in message >...
>
>>Great news this morning. No matter how I feel about US presence in Iraq,
>> it's great to know that the career of this ****head thug is over.
>>
>>Howie - who's going have a little extra energy doing those pullups today.
>
>
> How do you know its him and not one of his doubles?
>
> Steve

I don't know ****, man. Just think it would be weird to stick a double
in one of those mudholes with a ventillation fan.

Howard

Dally
December 14th 03, 11:10 PM
Howard Garland wrote:

>> How do you know its him and not one of his doubles?
>
> I don't know ****, man. Just think it would be weird to stick a double
> in one of those mudholes with a ventillation fan.

In case you're serious:

The video showed him having his mouth swabbed. That was for a quickie
DNA test. They waited to announce it until it came back positive. (He
also had scars on him from previously documented assasination attempts.)

Dally

Robert Dorf
December 14th 03, 11:10 PM
On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 18:10:37 -0500, Dally > wrote:

>Howard Garland wrote:
>
>>> How do you know its him and not one of his doubles?
>>
>> I don't know ****, man. Just think it would be weird to stick a double
>> in one of those mudholes with a ventillation fan.
>
>In case you're serious:
>
>The video showed him having his mouth swabbed. That was for a quickie
>DNA test. They waited to announce it until it came back positive. (He
>also had scars on him from previously documented assasination attempts.)
>
All of that means nothing to a properly motivated conspiracy theorist.

Howard Garland
December 14th 03, 11:47 PM
Dally wrote:

> Howard Garland wrote:
>
>>> How do you know its him and not one of his doubles?
>>
>>
>> I don't know ****, man. Just think it would be weird to stick a double
>> in one of those mudholes with a ventillation fan.
>
>
> In case you're serious:
>
> The video showed him having his mouth swabbed. That was for a quickie
> DNA test. They waited to announce it until it came back positive. (He
> also had scars on him from previously documented assasination attempts.)
>
> Dally

Thanks for the information. Haven't been following this since the
morning. Did some tough pullups and a little bicep work, then off for a nap.

Howard

Lucas Buck
December 14th 03, 11:51 PM
On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 18:10:37 -0500, Dally > wrote:

>Howard Garland wrote:
>
>>> How do you know its him and not one of his doubles?
>>
>> I don't know ****, man. Just think it would be weird to stick a double
>> in one of those mudholes with a ventillation fan.
>
>In case you're serious:
>
>The video showed him having his mouth swabbed. That was for a quickie
>DNA test. They waited to announce it until it came back positive.

In other words, they wanted to make sure he had DNA?

John HUDSON
December 14th 03, 11:59 PM
On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 12:54:01 -0500, Dally > wrote:

>John HUDSON wrote:
>
>> We are making enormous progress towards trans-Atlantic tolerance and
>> understanding JC! ;o)
>
>I suppose it makes a difference where you mean by trans-Atlantic.
>
>Dally, who notes the middle East is on that side of the Pond

By that kind of navigation so is Japan! ;o)

Howard Garland
December 15th 03, 12:00 AM
Lucas Buck wrote:

> On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 18:10:37 -0500, Dally > wrote:
>
>
>>Howard Garland wrote:
>>
>>
>>>>How do you know its him and not one of his doubles?
>>>
>>>I don't know ****, man. Just think it would be weird to stick a double
>>>in one of those mudholes with a ventillation fan.
>>
>>In case you're serious:
>>
>>The video showed him having his mouth swabbed. That was for a quickie
>>DNA test. They waited to announce it until it came back positive.
>
>
> In other words, they wanted to make sure he had DNA?

lol!

John HUDSON
December 15th 03, 12:04 AM
On Mon, 15 Dec 2003 04:58:04 +1100, "DRS"
> wrote:

>JC Der Koenig > wrote in message

>> The shortest way between two points is a straight line. Very simple.
>
>Only if the universe is flat, which it isn't.

From a navigation point of view "the shortest way between two points"
on a chart is always indicated by a straight line.

> And stop top-posting.

Proton Soup
December 15th 03, 01:03 AM
On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 18:10:37 -0500, Robert Dorf
> wrote:

>On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 18:10:37 -0500, Dally > wrote:
>
>>Howard Garland wrote:
>>
>>>> How do you know its him and not one of his doubles?
>>>
>>> I don't know ****, man. Just think it would be weird to stick a double
>>> in one of those mudholes with a ventillation fan.
>>
>>In case you're serious:
>>
>>The video showed him having his mouth swabbed. That was for a quickie
>>DNA test. They waited to announce it until it came back positive. (He
>>also had scars on him from previously documented assasination attempts.)
>>
>All of that means nothing to a properly motivated conspiracy theorist.

Yeah. What if that was just a double, and he had recently given his
supreme leader a quickie before he slipped away?

Proton Soup

Lee Michaels
December 15th 03, 01:12 AM
"Dally" > wrote in message
...
> Howard Garland wrote:
>
> >> How do you know its him and not one of his doubles?
> >
> > I don't know ****, man. Just think it would be weird to stick a double
> > in one of those mudholes with a ventillation fan.
>
> In case you're serious:
>
> The video showed him having his mouth swabbed. That was for a quickie
> DNA test. They waited to announce it until it came back positive. (He
> also had scars on him from previously documented assasination attempts.)
>

How many doubles would admit to being Saddam Hussein? He said who he was.

Dally
December 15th 03, 01:17 AM
Lee Michaels wrote:

> How many doubles would admit to being Saddam Hussein? He said who he was.

You're not a very good conspiracy theorist, are you?

Dally

MJL
December 15th 03, 01:19 AM
On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 15:16:53 GMT, "Bill K" > wrote:

>
>"Howard Garland" > wrote in message
...
>> Great news this morning. No matter how I feel about US presence in Iraq,
>> it's great to know that the career of this ****head thug is over.
>
>Roger that!
>
>But the one I really want is Bin Laden....
>
>
>
>Bill K.
>

Yes, bin laden getting checked for lice on worldwide TV would be
sweet.

August Pamplona
December 15th 03, 01:21 AM
"Lee Michaels" > wrote in message
news:[email protected]_s51...
>
> "Dally" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Howard Garland wrote:
> >
> > >> How do you know its him and not one of his doubles?
> > >
> > > I don't know ****, man. Just think it would be weird to stick a
double
> > > in one of those mudholes with a ventillation fan.
> >
> > In case you're serious:
> >
> > The video showed him having his mouth swabbed. That was for a
quickie
> > DNA test. They waited to announce it until it came back positive.
(He
> > also had scars on him from previously documented assasination
attempts.)
> >
>
> How many doubles would admit to being Saddam Hussein? He said who he
was.
>

But, as I've seen asked elsewhere, what would they do for a Klondike
bar?

August Pamplona
--
The waterfall in Java is not wet.
- omegazero2003 on m.f.w.

a.a. # 1811 apatriot #20 Eater of smut
To email replace 'necatoramericanusancylostomaduodenale' with
'cosmicaug'

MJL
December 15th 03, 01:22 AM
On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 19:46:19 GMT, "OmegaZero2003"
> wrote:

>There it is folks, DRS has been to everywhere in the Universe to ascertain
>its geometry and to boot, has the insight and mathematical rigor of top
>theoretical cosmologists.
>
>In a pig's eye! BWHAHAHAHAHAH!
>
>
>"DRS" > wrote in message
...
>> JC Der Koenig > wrote in message
>>
>> > The shortest way between two points is a straight line. Very simple.
>>
>> Only if the universe is flat, which it isn't. And stop top-posting.
>>
>> --
>>
>> "Posting at the top because that's where the cursor happened to be is like
>> ****ting in your pants because that's where your asshole happened to be."
>> Andreas Prilop
>>
>>
>

"The" universe may actually fit on the head of a pin.

August Pamplona
December 15th 03, 01:23 AM
"Dally" > wrote in message
...
> Lee Michaels wrote:
>
> > How many doubles would admit to being Saddam Hussein? He said who
he was.
>
> You're not a very good conspiracy theorist, are you?
>
> Dally

Ha! That's just what he wants yout to think.

August Pamplona
--
The waterfall in Java is not wet.
- omegazero2003 on m.f.w.

a.a. # 1811 apatriot #20 Eater of smut
To email replace 'necatoramericanusancylostomaduodenale' with
'cosmicaug'

Lee Michaels
December 15th 03, 01:32 AM
"Dally" > wrote in message
...
> Lee Michaels wrote:
>
> > How many doubles would admit to being Saddam Hussein? He said who he
was.
>
> You're not a very good conspiracy theorist, are you?
>

Sorry about that. If I were to dabble in conspiracy theory, it would be
cosmic in nature. Which would be more plausible than any of this petty
planet earth stuff.

The ultimate irony about the capture was that it took place across from one
of the presidential palaces that he built.

He had been reduced to an old, hunted man in a hole in the ground. With a
suitcase full of money.

Many arabs were upset he didn't go out fighting till dead like his sons did.
They considered what he did cowardly. I wonder how much better it is for us
that he is alive?

Donovan Rebbechi
December 15th 03, 02:04 AM
In article <[email protected]_s52>, Lee Michaels wrote:

> Many arabs were upset he didn't go out fighting till dead like his sons did.
> They considered what he did cowardly. I wonder how much better it is for us
> that he is alive?

Not only do I personally enjoy seeing these tough-talking dictators cut down
to size when they are under the gun, I think getting him like this really
damages his cult-hero status. IOW, it's a big propoganda win, IMO.

But the tricky part is, how should he be dealt with ? Whatever means is used
to try him, it must be carried out in a way that's perceived as fair. If he
was tried by Iraqis in Iraq, that could deal a further blow to his image, as
long as the trial wasn't seen as a proxy for some sort of tribal in-fighting.

Cheers,
--
Donovan Rebbechi
http://pegasus.rutgers.edu/~elflord/

Proton Soup
December 15th 03, 02:07 AM
On Mon, 15 Dec 2003 01:32:36 GMT, "Lee Michaels"
> wrote:

>
>"Dally" > wrote in message
...
>> Lee Michaels wrote:
>>
>> > How many doubles would admit to being Saddam Hussein? He said who he
>was.
>>
>> You're not a very good conspiracy theorist, are you?
>>
>
>Sorry about that. If I were to dabble in conspiracy theory, it would be
>cosmic in nature. Which would be more plausible than any of this petty
>planet earth stuff.
>
>The ultimate irony about the capture was that it took place across from one
>of the presidential palaces that he built.
>
>He had been reduced to an old, hunted man in a hole in the ground. With a
>suitcase full of money.
>
>Many arabs were upset he didn't go out fighting till dead like his sons did.
>They considered what he did cowardly. I wonder how much better it is for us
>that he is alive?

It's still up in the air whether or not his trial will include the
death penalty as an option. His co-operation or lack thereof could
certainly influence whether or not we allow the Iraqi justice system
full access to the man. Death is not an option if he is tried in the
Hague. He'd spend the remainder of his years in a European prison.

Proton Soup

Robert Dorf
December 15th 03, 02:11 AM
On Mon, 15 Dec 2003 02:04:49 +0000 (UTC), Donovan Rebbechi
> wrote:

>In article <[email protected]_s52>, Lee Michaels wrote:
>
>> Many arabs were upset he didn't go out fighting till dead like his sons did.
>> They considered what he did cowardly. I wonder how much better it is for us
>> that he is alive?
>
>Not only do I personally enjoy seeing these tough-talking dictators cut down
>to size when they are under the gun, I think getting him like this really
>damages his cult-hero status. IOW, it's a big propoganda win, IMO.
>
>But the tricky part is, how should he be dealt with ? Whatever means is used
>to try him, it must be carried out in a way that's perceived as fair. If he
>was tried by Iraqis in Iraq, that could deal a further blow to his image, as
>long as the trial wasn't seen as a proxy for some sort of tribal in-fighting.
>
Any trial will be viewed in the Al-Jazeera broadcast area as fixed by
the Americans. A UN supported trial in Iraq might have some
diplomatic value in Europe.
I wonder how long it will take the French government to suggest giving
him amnesty and a nice pension in exchange for "cooperation."

Dally
December 15th 03, 02:15 AM
Proton Soup wrote:
> Death is not an option if he is tried in the
> Hague. He'd spend the remainder of his years in a European prison.

A little known fact: there were four people killed in the attack that
got Saddam's sons: a loyal staff person and Saddam's 14 year old
grandson besides the two sons. As far as I know it was his only
grandson. (I could be wrong.) (The part where we victoriously
slaughtered a child didn't get a lot of press.)

I bet it makes for a very long dotage to know that your actions got all
of your descendents killed.

Dally, didn't care for Ruby Ridge, either

gps
December 15th 03, 02:21 AM
Robert Dorf wrote:
>
> On Mon, 15 Dec 2003 02:04:49 +0000 (UTC), Donovan Rebbechi
> > wrote:
>
> >In article <Ua8Db.51276$8y1.[email protected]_s52>, Lee Michaels wrote:
> >
> >> Many arabs were upset he didn't go out fighting till dead like his sons did.
> >> They considered what he did cowardly. I wonder how much better it is for us
> >> that he is alive?
> >
> >Not only do I personally enjoy seeing these tough-talking dictators cut down
> >to size when they are under the gun, I think getting him like this really
> >damages his cult-hero status. IOW, it's a big propoganda win, IMO.
> >
> >But the tricky part is, how should he be dealt with ? Whatever means is used
> >to try him, it must be carried out in a way that's perceived as fair. If he
> >was tried by Iraqis in Iraq, that could deal a further blow to his image, as
> >long as the trial wasn't seen as a proxy for some sort of tribal in-fighting.
> >
> Any trial will be viewed in the Al-Jazeera broadcast area as fixed by
> the Americans.

Sadly, I think this is true, by and large.

> A UN supported trial in Iraq might have some diplomatic value in Europe.

What about the hague/world court? Didn't it try Milosivic?

> I wonder how long it will take the French government to suggest giving
> him amnesty and a nice pension in exchange for "cooperation."

I wouldn't be surprised if Jacques suggests it would be a nice Christmas
gesture; iow, not long. :)
ps

Robert Dorf
December 15th 03, 02:32 AM
On Mon, 15 Dec 2003 02:21:15 GMT, gps > wrote:

>Robert Dorf wrote:
>>
>> On Mon, 15 Dec 2003 02:04:49 +0000 (UTC), Donovan Rebbechi
>> > wrote:
>>
>> >In article <[email protected]_s52>, Lee Michaels wrote:
>> >
>> >> Many arabs were upset he didn't go out fighting till dead like his sons did.
>> >> They considered what he did cowardly. I wonder how much better it is for us
>> >> that he is alive?
>> >
>> >Not only do I personally enjoy seeing these tough-talking dictators cut down
>> >to size when they are under the gun, I think getting him like this really
>> >damages his cult-hero status. IOW, it's a big propoganda win, IMO.
>> >
>> >But the tricky part is, how should he be dealt with ? Whatever means is used
>> >to try him, it must be carried out in a way that's perceived as fair. If he
>> >was tried by Iraqis in Iraq, that could deal a further blow to his image, as
>> >long as the trial wasn't seen as a proxy for some sort of tribal in-fighting.
>> >
>> Any trial will be viewed in the Al-Jazeera broadcast area as fixed by
>> the Americans.
>
>Sadly, I think this is true, by and large.
>
>> A UN supported trial in Iraq might have some diplomatic value in Europe.
>
>What about the hague/world court? Didn't it try Milosivic?

Maybe, but I think the pressure to keep the trial in a predominantly
muslim country will be considerable, and those European countries with
large muslim populations will feel it. Milosevik never had the
little-guy-standing-up-to-America clout that Hussein has gained.

Robert Dorf
December 15th 03, 02:40 AM
On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 21:15:42 -0500, Dally > wrote:

>Proton Soup wrote:
>> Death is not an option if he is tried in the
>> Hague. He'd spend the remainder of his years in a European prison.
>
>A little known fact: there were four people killed in the attack that
>got Saddam's sons: a loyal staff person and Saddam's 14 year old
>grandson besides the two sons. As far as I know it was his only
>grandson. (I could be wrong.) (The part where we victoriously
>slaughtered a child didn't get a lot of press.)
>
>I bet it makes for a very long dotage to know that your actions got all
>of your descendents killed.
>
>Dally, didn't care for Ruby Ridge, either

So in your view the capture of a mass murderer like Hussein and the
slaughter of the family of a fairly inoffensive loony like Randy
Weaver are about equal?

Top Sirloin
December 15th 03, 02:41 AM
On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 15:16:53 GMT, "Bill K" > wrote:

>
>"Howard Garland" > wrote in message
...
>> Great news this morning. No matter how I feel about US presence in Iraq,
>> it's great to know that the career of this ****head thug is over.
>
>Roger that!
>
>But the one I really want is Bin Laden....

He's dead, Jim.


--

Scott Johnson
"be a man ,stop looking for handouts , eat ,lift and shut your mouth"
-John Carlo

Top Sirloin
December 15th 03, 02:42 AM
On 14 Dec 2003 17:18:27 GMT, (Scoot) wrote:

>>
>>
>>The best way to fix the problem would be to kill all arabs and muslims.
>>Let's get started.
>>
>>
>>
>
>Good idea. Then George W. Bush will have won his terrorist attack to take
>control of the mid-east oil fields....

Uh, if that was his plan why did we just give Iraq control of theirs?


--

Scott Johnson
"be a man ,stop looking for handouts , eat ,lift and shut your mouth"
-John Carlo

Top Sirloin
December 15th 03, 02:45 AM
On Mon, 15 Dec 2003 04:51:42 +1100, "DRS"
> wrote:

>John HUDSON > wrote in message

>
>[...]
>
>> If they are not for us then they are against us, and should be treated
>> accordingly.
>
>Er, no. Geopolitics is rarely if ever so simplistic or simple-minded, there
>being more than one way to skin a cat, etc...

Except when you're dealing with people who reneg on every treaty and openly call
for your destruction, in which case you should crush them.


--

Scott Johnson
"be a man ,stop looking for handouts , eat ,lift and shut your mouth"
-John Carlo

Donovan Rebbechi
December 15th 03, 02:51 AM
In article >, Top Sirloin wrote:
> On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 15:16:53 GMT, "Bill K" > wrote:
>
>>
>>"Howard Garland" > wrote in message
...
>>> Great news this morning. No matter how I feel about US presence in Iraq,
>>> it's great to know that the career of this ****head thug is over.
>>
>>Roger that!
>>
>>But the one I really want is Bin Laden....
>
> He's dead, Jim.

Dead but not unwanted (-; You know, the poster does say "wanted dead or alive".

Cheers,
--
Donovan Rebbechi
http://pegasus.rutgers.edu/~elflord/

Dally
December 15th 03, 02:59 AM
Robert Dorf wrote:

> On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 21:15:42 -0500, Dally > wrote:

>>A little known fact: there were four people killed in the attack that
>>got Saddam's sons: a loyal staff person and Saddam's 14 year old
>>grandson besides the two sons. As far as I know it was his only
>>grandson. (I could be wrong.) (The part where we victoriously
>>slaughtered a child didn't get a lot of press.)
>>
>>I bet it makes for a very long dotage to know that your actions got all
>>of your descendents killed.
>>
>>Dally, didn't care for Ruby Ridge, either
>
> So in your view the capture of a mass murderer like Hussein and the
> slaughter of the family of a fairly inoffensive loony like Randy
> Weaver are about equal?

Uh, no, and I don't even see how you got that. But in my view the
killing of the two 14 year olds in a gun battle is about equal. Please
note that I blame Saddam Hussein for doing stuff that led to the
slaughter of his sons and grandchild.

But I think that we're a bit too blase about what we're doing when the
death by gunfire of a 14 year old doesn't even make the press, much less
raise controversy. Some stories had a picture showing the three coffins
side by side but the accompanying story didn't mention why there were
three. At least one story implied through a grammatical blooper that
the third coffin was the loyalist adult. I stared at that grammatical
error and wondered which censor pulled the reference to the child. (I
only heard about this because I caught an interview with Saddam's
daughters who were mourning their nephew.)

Ruby Ridge had reasons. This did, too. But anytime we go gunning for
children I think we have to examine those reasons closely.

Dally

Dally
December 15th 03, 03:01 AM
Top Sirloin wrote:

> On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 15:16:53 GMT, "Bill K" > wrote:
>>But the one I really want is Bin Laden....
>
> He's dead, Jim.

I'm sorry, I've seen too many comic books to believe the villain is dead
when he dies outside the scene.

Dally

Proton Soup
December 15th 03, 03:15 AM
On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 21:59:21 -0500, Dally > wrote:

>
>Ruby Ridge had reasons. This did, too. But anytime we go gunning for
>children I think we have to examine those reasons closely.

Yeah, it had a reason alright. Read some Machiavelli to understand
how a display of brutality can be effective. People know you mean
business when you take out a mother holding her child in the doorway
of her home.

Proton Soup

Dally
December 15th 03, 03:55 AM
Proton Soup wrote:
> On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 21:59:21 -0500, Dally > wrote:
>
>>Ruby Ridge had reasons. This did, too. But anytime we go gunning for
>>children I think we have to examine those reasons closely.
>
> Yeah, it had a reason alright. Read some Machiavelli to understand
> how a display of brutality can be effective. People know you mean
> business when you take out a mother holding her child in the doorway
> of her home.

I prefer to think that the shooter (I forget, were they FBI?) screwed up
rather than targeted her. So the reasons were lack of training in this
sort of situation rather than trigger-happiness.

At least that's what I prefer to think.

As for Saddam's grandkid, they knew he was in there but the forces
attacking them didn't let that take a gunfight off the table. I don't
know enough about what their options were to judge that, but I think it
is worth thinking about.

I also think it's possible that a 14 year old wanted to die like a man
and his father thought that made sense given the situation and their own
brutal worldview that didn't understand mercy. In this scenario the kid
wasn't going to come out and the father wasn't going to be talked into
letting the kid out.

What I do know is that the owner of the house TOLD the attacking forces
that there was a kid in there. His death really shook up the
home-owner's family. I don't think they realized the kid would get
killed when they snitched on Saddam's sons for the reward.

Dally

Lucas Buck
December 15th 03, 04:29 AM
On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 21:59:21 -0500, Dally > wrote:

>Robert Dorf wrote:
>
>> On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 21:15:42 -0500, Dally > wrote:
>
>>>A little known fact: there were four people killed in the attack that
>>>got Saddam's sons: a loyal staff person and Saddam's 14 year old
>>>grandson besides the two sons. As far as I know it was his only
>>>grandson. (I could be wrong.) (The part where we victoriously
>>>slaughtered a child didn't get a lot of press.)
>>>
>>>I bet it makes for a very long dotage to know that your actions got all
>>>of your descendents killed.
>>>
>>>Dally, didn't care for Ruby Ridge, either
>>
>> So in your view the capture of a mass murderer like Hussein and the
>> slaughter of the family of a fairly inoffensive loony like Randy
>> Weaver are about equal?
>
>Uh, no, and I don't even see how you got that. But in my view the
>killing of the two 14 year olds in a gun battle is about equal.

Who EXACTLY shot the kid? Do you know it was from coalition gunfire
rather than "friendly" fire?


>But I think that we're a bit too blase about what we're doing when the
>death by gunfire of a 14 year old doesn't even make the press,

Did here.

Lucas Buck
December 15th 03, 04:33 AM
On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 22:55:09 -0500, Dally > wrote:

>Proton Soup wrote:
>> On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 21:59:21 -0500, Dally > wrote:
>>
>>>Ruby Ridge had reasons. This did, too. But anytime we go gunning for
>>>children I think we have to examine those reasons closely.
>>
>> Yeah, it had a reason alright. Read some Machiavelli to understand
>> how a display of brutality can be effective. People know you mean
>> business when you take out a mother holding her child in the doorway
>> of her home.
>
>I prefer to think that the shooter (I forget, were they FBI?) screwed up
>rather than targeted her. So the reasons were lack of training in this
>sort of situation rather than trigger-happiness.

Given that Lon Horiuchi was one of the best-trained snipers in Federal
employ at the time, your faith is misguided.

>At least that's what I prefer to think.

What is Santa bringing you this year?

>As for Saddam's grandkid, they knew he was in there but the forces
>attacking them didn't let that take a gunfight off the table. I don't
>know enough about what their options were to judge that,

You don't know enough about the case to judge SQUAT.

>I also think it's possible that a 14 year old wanted to die like a man
>and his father thought that made sense given the situation and their own
>brutal worldview that didn't understand mercy. In this scenario the kid
>wasn't going to come out and the father wasn't going to be talked into
>letting the kid out.

But you refuse to consider that one of the sons killed the kid to keep him
from talking about hidden weapons or cash.

Dally
December 15th 03, 04:40 AM
Lucas Buck wrote:

> On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 22:55:09 -0500, Dally > wrote:
>
>>Proton Soup wrote:
>>
>>>On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 21:59:21 -0500, Dally > wrote:
>>>
>>>>Ruby Ridge had reasons. This did, too. But anytime we go gunning for
>>>>children I think we have to examine those reasons closely.
>>>
>>>Yeah, it had a reason alright. Read some Machiavelli to understand
>>>how a display of brutality can be effective. People know you mean
>>>business when you take out a mother holding her child in the doorway
>>>of her home.
>>
>>I prefer to think that the shooter (I forget, were they FBI?) screwed up
>>rather than targeted her. So the reasons were lack of training in this
>>sort of situation rather than trigger-happiness.
>
> Given that Lon Horiuchi was one of the best-trained snipers in Federal
> employ at the time, your faith is misguided.

So your position is that he was aiming for the mother holding the baby?
I recall the criminal negligence theory, but I didn't realize people
were calling it intentional homicide. I stayed away from most of the
more vehement threads on Ruby Ridge back then.

>
>>At least that's what I prefer to think.
>
> What is Santa bringing you this year?

My guess is NOT peace on earth.

>>As for Saddam's grandkid, they knew he was in there but the forces
>>attacking them didn't let that take a gunfight off the table. I don't
>>know enough about what their options were to judge that,
>
> You don't know enough about the case to judge SQUAT.

And so I'm not. What's your point? Or was that a weird grammatical
wandering onto topic and asking if I can judge your squat? Send mpegs.

>>I also think it's possible that a 14 year old wanted to die like a man
>>and his father thought that made sense given the situation and their own
>>brutal worldview that didn't understand mercy. In this scenario the kid
>>wasn't going to come out and the father wasn't going to be talked into
>>letting the kid out.
>
> But you refuse to consider that one of the sons killed the kid to keep him
> from talking about hidden weapons or cash.

I hadn't considered it, but wouldn't therefore say I "refuse" to
consider it. Why, do you think it likely that the child was murdered by
his father or uncle before the coalition forces started blasting them
away? (And you are futher positing that the coilition forces KNEW the
child was already dead and therefore a gun battle wouldn't endanger him?)

I'm intrigued by your theory that they would kill their child to protect
some secret. Is that common in your world?

Dally

gps
December 15th 03, 04:40 AM
Dally wrote:
>
> Top Sirloin wrote:
>
> > On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 15:16:53 GMT, "Bill K" > wrote:
> >>But the one I really want is Bin Laden....
> >
> > He's dead, Jim.
>
> I'm sorry, I've seen too many comic books to believe the villain is dead
> when he dies outside the scene.
>
> Dally

Your reliance on comic books for your information is amply evidenced by
your posts.
ps

gps
December 15th 03, 04:48 AM
Dally wrote:
>
> Proton Soup wrote:
> > Death is not an option if he is tried in the
> > Hague. He'd spend the remainder of his years in a European prison.
>
> A little known fact: there were four people killed in the attack that
> got Saddam's sons:

This was highly publicized at the time of the incident and is well
known.

> a loyal staff person and Saddam's 14 year old
> grandson besides the two sons. As far as I know it was his only
> grandson. (I could be wrong.) (The part where we victoriously
> slaughtered a child didn't get a lot of press.)

It received a large amount of press. It was included in every published
story, whether print or internet, I read at the time of the incident,
and it was included in every televised coverage of the story I saw at
the time as well.

No one was "victoriously slaughtered," and your choice of language is an
insult to those who participated in the raid and who insure your safety
with their lives. The people killed in this raid were killed resisting
arrest. They could have surrendered without a shot being fired, just as
grandpa did, but they chose to resist.

Do you chastise the law enforcement personnel who patrol your area and
grieve for the burglars, rapists, and murderers who are arrested, too?
ps

gps
December 15th 03, 04:53 AM
Robert Dorf wrote:
>
> On Mon, 15 Dec 2003 02:21:15 GMT, gps > wrote:
>
> >Robert Dorf wrote:
> >>
> >> On Mon, 15 Dec 2003 02:04:49 +0000 (UTC), Donovan Rebbechi
> >> > wrote:
> >>
> >> >In article <[email protected]_s52>, Lee Michaels wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> Many arabs were upset he didn't go out fighting till dead like his sons did.
> >> >> They considered what he did cowardly. I wonder how much better it is for us
> >> >> that he is alive?
> >> >
> >> >Not only do I personally enjoy seeing these tough-talking dictators cut down
> >> >to size when they are under the gun, I think getting him like this really
> >> >damages his cult-hero status. IOW, it's a big propoganda win, IMO.
> >> >
> >> >But the tricky part is, how should he be dealt with ? Whatever means is used
> >> >to try him, it must be carried out in a way that's perceived as fair. If he
> >> >was tried by Iraqis in Iraq, that could deal a further blow to his image, as
> >> >long as the trial wasn't seen as a proxy for some sort of tribal in-fighting.
> >> >
> >> Any trial will be viewed in the Al-Jazeera broadcast area as fixed by
> >> the Americans.
> >
> >Sadly, I think this is true, by and large.
> >
> >> A UN supported trial in Iraq might have some diplomatic value in Europe.
> >
> >What about the hague/world court? Didn't it try Milosivic?
>
> Maybe, but I think the pressure to keep the trial in a predominantly
> muslim country will be considerable, and those European countries with
> large muslim populations will feel it. Milosevik never had the
> little-guy-standing-up-to-America clout that Hussein has gained.

Perhaps a sharia court then?
ps

Donovan Rebbechi
December 15th 03, 05:00 AM
In article >, gps wrote:
> Robert Dorf wrote:
>>
>> On Mon, 15 Dec 2003 02:21:15 GMT, gps > wrote:
>>
>> >Robert Dorf wrote:
>> >>
>> >> On Mon, 15 Dec 2003 02:04:49 +0000 (UTC), Donovan Rebbechi
>> >> > wrote:
>> >>
>> >> >In article <[email protected]_s52>, Lee Michaels wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> >> Many arabs were upset he didn't go out fighting till dead like his sons did.
>> >> >> They considered what he did cowardly. I wonder how much better it is for us
>> >> >> that he is alive?
>> >> >
>> >> >Not only do I personally enjoy seeing these tough-talking dictators cut down
>> >> >to size when they are under the gun, I think getting him like this really
>> >> >damages his cult-hero status. IOW, it's a big propoganda win, IMO.
>> >> >
>> >> >But the tricky part is, how should he be dealt with ? Whatever means is used
>> >> >to try him, it must be carried out in a way that's perceived as fair. If he
>> >> >was tried by Iraqis in Iraq, that could deal a further blow to his image, as
>> >> >long as the trial wasn't seen as a proxy for some sort of tribal in-fighting.
>> >> >
>> >> Any trial will be viewed in the Al-Jazeera broadcast area as fixed by
>> >> the Americans.
>> >
>> >Sadly, I think this is true, by and large.
>> >
>> >> A UN supported trial in Iraq might have some diplomatic value in Europe.
>> >
>> >What about the hague/world court? Didn't it try Milosivic?
>>
>> Maybe, but I think the pressure to keep the trial in a predominantly
>> muslim country will be considerable, and those European countries with
>> large muslim populations will feel it. Milosevik never had the
>> little-guy-standing-up-to-America clout that Hussein has gained.
>
> Perhaps a sharia court then?

Of course you're joking here, but this would ultimately turn into a sort of
ethnic/religious in-fight. He needs to be condemned by what's seen as a fairly
broad group of Iraqis.

Cheers,
--
Donovan Rebbechi
http://pegasus.rutgers.edu/~elflord/

Robert Dorf
December 15th 03, 05:06 AM
On Mon, 15 Dec 2003 04:53:10 GMT, gps > wrote:

>Robert Dorf wrote:
>>
>> On Mon, 15 Dec 2003 02:21:15 GMT, gps > wrote:
>>
>> >Robert Dorf wrote:
>> >>
>> >> A UN supported trial in Iraq might have some diplomatic value in Europe.
>> >
>> >What about the hague/world court? Didn't it try Milosivic?
>>
>> Maybe, but I think the pressure to keep the trial in a predominantly
>> muslim country will be considerable, and those European countries with
>> large muslim populations will feel it. Milosevik never had the
>> little-guy-standing-up-to-America clout that Hussein has gained.
>
>Perhaps a sharia court then?
>ps

Wouldn't be surprised to hear it suggested (subtlety or no).

Dally
December 15th 03, 05:12 AM
gps wrote:

> Dally wrote:
>
>>Top Sirloin wrote:
>>
>>
>>>On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 15:16:53 GMT, "Bill K" > wrote:
>>>
>>>>But the one I really want is Bin Laden....
>>>
>>>He's dead, Jim.
>>
>>I'm sorry, I've seen too many comic books to believe the villain is dead
>>when he dies outside the scene.
>>
>>Dally
>
>
> Your reliance on comic books for your information is amply evidenced by
> your posts.
> ps

Oooh, that's almost witty.

Dally

Dally
December 15th 03, 05:14 AM
gps wrote:

> Dally wrote:
>
>>Proton Soup wrote:
>>
>>> Death is not an option if he is tried in the
>>>Hague. He'd spend the remainder of his years in a European prison.
>>
>>A little known fact: there were four people killed in the attack that
>>got Saddam's sons:
>
>
> This was highly publicized at the time of the incident and is well
> known.

Good. It wasn't around me. My impression is that public awareness is a
bit lacking on many fronts. For example, I'm surrounded by people who
think we've finally caught the guy who bombed the World Trade Centers.
The little old ladies are the hardest to convince that those planes
weren't filled with Iraquis.

Dally

Dally
December 15th 03, 05:24 AM
gps wrote:

> No one was "victoriously slaughtered," and your choice of language is an
> insult to those who participated in the raid and who insure your safety
> with their lives. The people killed in this raid were killed resisting
> arrest. They could have surrendered without a shot being fired, just as
> grandpa did, but they chose to resist.

My stance is simply that non-lethal force ought to be used on 14 year
olds whenever possible. I agree that "slaughtered" is incendiary. But
there was great rejoicing over their deaths so I'm going to stick with
the "victoriously" part. Why, did you in your superior news coverage
hear people saying that it was a shame to kill a kid?

> Do you chastise the law enforcement personnel who patrol your area

When they shoot children? Nah, they get three free passes.

> and
> grieve for the burglars, rapists, and murderers who are arrested, too?

Sometimes. Sometimes I grieve for their families.

Ever read Gorky Park? One of the points the cop makes is that nearly
all of the murders he encounters involves alcohol and people who
theoretically love each other. Murderers are usually caught crying over
the body. Those are the kind of murders we have here. I don't know if
I'm inordinately compassionate, but I find it quite easy to grieve for
the murderers.

I live in a small town. Each person's loss diminishes us all. Ask not
for whom the bell tolls, and all that. Why, don't you grieve over sad
outcomes?

Are you trying to make me into some sort of cop or soldier hater? You'd
be wrong.

Dally

Robert Dorf
December 15th 03, 05:33 AM
On Mon, 15 Dec 2003 00:24:39 -0500, Dally > wrote:


>
>My stance is simply that non-lethal force ought to be used on 14 year
>olds whenever possible.

Obviously you've never taught in a public school.

Dally
December 15th 03, 05:54 AM
Robert Dorf wrote:

> On Mon, 15 Dec 2003 00:24:39 -0500, Dally > wrote:
>
>
>
>>My stance is simply that non-lethal force ought to be used on 14 year
>>olds whenever possible.
>
> Obviously you've never taught in a public school.

Another good point. Also please note that my oldest is 13. I reserve
the right to change my mind on this point.

Dally

Proton Soup
December 15th 03, 06:24 AM
On Mon, 15 Dec 2003 00:54:35 -0500, Dally > wrote:

>Robert Dorf wrote:
>
>> On Mon, 15 Dec 2003 00:24:39 -0500, Dally > wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>>My stance is simply that non-lethal force ought to be used on 14 year
>>>olds whenever possible.
>>
>> Obviously you've never taught in a public school.
>
>Another good point. Also please note that my oldest is 13. I reserve
>the right to change my mind on this point.

Agreed. Abortion should be legal between the 56th and 83rd trimesters.

Parents can't really judge whether they've made a mistake until then.

Proton Soup

Lucas Buck
December 15th 03, 08:43 AM
On Mon, 15 Dec 2003 04:53:10 GMT, gps > wrote:

>> >What about the hague/world court? Didn't it try Milosivic?
>>
>> Maybe, but I think the pressure to keep the trial in a predominantly
>> muslim country will be considerable, and those European countries with
>> large muslim populations will feel it. Milosevik never had the
>> little-guy-standing-up-to-America clout that Hussein has gained.
>
>Perhaps a sharia court then?
>ps

Or a Shakira court?
Or a Shania court?

David Cohen
December 15th 03, 09:19 AM
"Lucas Buck" > wrote
> gps > wrote:
>
> >> >What about the hague/world court? Didn't it try Milosivic?
> >>
> >> Maybe, but I think the pressure to keep the trial in a
predominantly
> >> muslim country will be considerable, and those European countries
with
> >> large muslim populations will feel it. Milosevik never had the
> >> little-guy-standing-up-to-America clout that Hussein has gained.
> >
> >Perhaps a sharia court then?
>
> Or a Shakira court?
> Or a Shania court?

I'm doubly guilty. They can punish me now.

Please. Now.

David

William Brink
December 15th 03, 01:38 PM
In article <[email protected]_s52>,
"Lee Michaels" > wrote:

> "Dally" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Lee Michaels wrote:
> >
> > > How many doubles would admit to being Saddam Hussein? He said who he
> was.
> >
> > You're not a very good conspiracy theorist, are you?
> >
>
> Sorry about that. If I were to dabble in conspiracy theory, it would be
> cosmic in nature. Which would be more plausible than any of this petty
> planet earth stuff.
>
> The ultimate irony about the capture was that it took place across from one
> of the presidential palaces that he built.
>
> He had been reduced to an old, hunted man in a hole in the ground. With a
> suitcase full of money.
>
> Many arabs were upset he didn't go out fighting till dead like his sons did.
> They considered what he did cowardly.

Showig his true nature, that of simple bully. The arab mentallity being
what it is, it's much better they see what a weak scared sack he really
is.

> I wonder how much better it is for us
> that he is alive?

I have the feeling the people sent to find him were under very strict
orders to get him alive if at all possible for many reasons. Most feel
it was a real mistake allowing the sons to go out in a blaze of glory.

>
>
>
>

--
Will Brink

http://www.brinkzone.com/
http://musclebuildingnutrition.com/
http://www.aboutsupplements.com/

William Brink
December 15th 03, 01:44 PM
In article >,
Dally > wrote:

> Proton Soup wrote:
> > Death is not an option if he is tried in the
> > Hague. He'd spend the remainder of his years in a European prison.
>
> A little known fact: there were four people killed in the attack that
> got Saddam's sons: a loyal staff person and Saddam's 14 year old
> grandson besides the two sons.

So what? Was he armed? Do we know? Was he simply caught in the cross
fire or did they snipe him from 500 yards thinking he was a guard. ****
happens, such things aint pretty. Deal with it.

> As far as I know it was his only
> grandson. (I could be wrong.) (The part where we victoriously
> slaughtered a child didn't get a lot of press.)

Why should it? I am sure the details will come out shortly and all the
hand ringing second guessers who have seen to many movies will tell them
how they should have snuck up and put a sleeping dart into the kid, etc,
etc. I know several people who are active in special ops and are over
there and other locals. Not one of them really wants to kill 14 years
olds if it can be avoided. If it cant, then it cant, but they will avoid
it if at all possible.

>
> I bet it makes for a very long dotage to know that your actions got all
> of your descendents killed.

You think he cares?

>
> Dally, didn't care for Ruby Ridge, either
>

--
Will Brink

http://www.brinkzone.com/
http://musclebuildingnutrition.com/
http://www.aboutsupplements.com/

William Brink
December 15th 03, 01:51 PM
In article >,
Lucas Buck > wrote:

> On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 22:55:09 -0500, Dally > wrote:
>
> >Proton Soup wrote:
> >> On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 21:59:21 -0500, Dally > wrote:
> >>
> >>>Ruby Ridge had reasons. This did, too. But anytime we go gunning for
> >>>children I think we have to examine those reasons closely.
> >>
> >> Yeah, it had a reason alright. Read some Machiavelli to understand
> >> how a display of brutality can be effective. People know you mean
> >> business when you take out a mother holding her child in the doorway
> >> of her home.
> >
> >I prefer to think that the shooter (I forget, were they FBI?) screwed up
> >rather than targeted her. So the reasons were lack of training in this
> >sort of situation rather than trigger-happiness.
>
> Given that Lon Horiuchi was one of the best-trained snipers in Federal
> employ at the time, your faith is misguided.

Best case, he was guilty of bad judgement, not bad shooting per se.
Worst case, he fired at anything that moved out of revenge.

--
Will Brink

http://www.brinkzone.com/
http://musclebuildingnutrition.com/
http://www.aboutsupplements.com/

William Brink
December 15th 03, 01:53 PM
In article >,
Robert Dorf > wrote:

> On Mon, 15 Dec 2003 02:04:49 +0000 (UTC), Donovan Rebbechi
> > wrote:
>
> >In article <[email protected]_s52>, Lee Michaels wrote:
> >
> >> Many arabs were upset he didn't go out fighting till dead like his sons
> >> did.
> >> They considered what he did cowardly. I wonder how much better it is for
> >> us
> >> that he is alive?
> >
> >Not only do I personally enjoy seeing these tough-talking dictators cut down
> >to size when they are under the gun, I think getting him like this really
> >damages his cult-hero status. IOW, it's a big propoganda win, IMO.
> >
> >But the tricky part is, how should he be dealt with ? Whatever means is used
> >to try him, it must be carried out in a way that's perceived as fair. If he
> >was tried by Iraqis in Iraq, that could deal a further blow to his image, as
> >long as the trial wasn't seen as a proxy for some sort of tribal
> >in-fighting.
> >
> Any trial will be viewed in the Al-Jazeera broadcast area as fixed by
> the Americans. A UN supported trial in Iraq might have some
> diplomatic value in Europe.
> I wonder how long it will take the French government to suggest giving
> him amnesty and a nice pension in exchange for "cooperation."

NPR stated it had already been decided and would take place in Iraq.

--
Will Brink

http://www.brinkzone.com/
http://musclebuildingnutrition.com/
http://www.aboutsupplements.com/

William Brink
December 15th 03, 02:01 PM
In article >,
"Bill" > wrote:

> > > >>>This is the greatest news and rivals even England's winning of the
> > > >>>Rugby World Cup.
>
> It means about as much as a sports event except to those who have to dodge
> IED's or to those who ultimately have to pay the enormous cost of the
> effort.
>
> > > >>>I hope this marks the beginning of the end of our involvement in that
> > > >>>troubled region.
>
> A lot of Iraqis and other Arabs feel badly that the US had to find him.
> They do not want our involvement either.
>
> > > Cool, but not ALL arabs or all Moslems (and there is a difference here),
> > > started this ****.
>
> British and US meddling goes back generations. Osama and the Taliban were
> part of the USCIA effort to encourage "terrorism" against the USSR in
> Afghanistan, e.g.
>
> We have met the enemy, and "they is us"

There is no doubt, cold war doctrine is coming back to bite us in the
ass in many ways as one would expect. I have the feeling on the larger
scale, pentagon planners consider it worth it. No doubt, we need to do a
better job of seeing how such things can have long term negative
outcomes.

>

--
Will Brink

http://www.brinkzone.com/
http://musclebuildingnutrition.com/
http://www.aboutsupplements.com/

William Brink
December 15th 03, 02:04 PM
In article >,
"JC Der Koenig" > wrote:

> "Scoot" > wrote in message
> ...
> > great, that's good to hear. Now I guess we can stop looking for Bin Laden
> and
> > the folks responsible for flying jets into the WTC, the Pentagon, as well
> as
> > the jet the passengers attempted to retake. We'll take the straw man
> instead
> > of those actually responsible for 3000 deaths.
> >
> > Way to fail gang..
> >
> >
>
> The best way to fix the problem would be to kill all arabs and muslims.
> Let's get started.

The best way to fix the prpblem would be to reduce our need for oil.
There is nothing we could do that would have as great an effect on US
security.

--
Will Brink

http://www.brinkzone.com/
http://musclebuildingnutrition.com/
http://www.aboutsupplements.com/

Steve
December 15th 03, 02:18 PM
Robert Dorf > wrote
> >The video showed him having his mouth swabbed. That was for a quickie
> >DNA test. They waited to announce it until it came back positive. (He
> >also had scars on him from previously documented assasination attempts.)
> >
> All of that means nothing to a properly motivated conspiracy theorist.

So you can't accept anything as true unless it is told to you on
television or printed in Time magazine?

Robert Dorf
December 15th 03, 02:26 PM
On 15 Dec 2003 06:18:19 -0800, (Steve) wrote:

>Robert Dorf > wrote
>> >The video showed him having his mouth swabbed. That was for a quickie
>> >DNA test. They waited to announce it until it came back positive. (He
>> >also had scars on him from previously documented assasination attempts.)
>> >
>> All of that means nothing to a properly motivated conspiracy theorist.
>
>So you can't accept anything as true unless it is told to you on
>television or printed in Time magazine?

I suggest you work on your reading comprehension.

DRS
December 15th 03, 03:46 PM
John HUDSON > wrote in message

> On Mon, 15 Dec 2003 04:58:04 +1100, "DRS"
> > wrote:
>> JC Der Koenig > wrote in message
>>
>>> The shortest way between two points is a straight line. Very simple.
>>
>> Only if the universe is flat, which it isn't.
>
> From a navigation point of view "the shortest way between two points"
> on a chart is always indicated by a straight line.

Have you ever looked at non-Euclidian geometry? In a curved universe
straight doesn't necessarily mean what you think it does.

--

"Posting at the top because that's where the cursor happened to be is like
****ting in your pants because that's where your asshole happened to be."
Andreas Prilop

OmegaZero2003
December 15th 03, 06:30 PM
Yeah - bin laden will be next if he is not dead.

If Henry had his left-wing extremist way (ala Dean-boy), Saddam would still
be killing innocent Iraqis by the thousands.


"MJL" > wrote in message
...
> On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 15:16:53 GMT, "Bill K" > wrote:
>
> >
> >"Howard Garland" > wrote in message
> ...
> >> Great news this morning. No matter how I feel about US presence in
Iraq,
> >> it's great to know that the career of this ****head thug is over.
> >
> >Roger that!
> >
> >But the one I really want is Bin Laden....
> >
> >
> >
> >Bill K.
> >
>
> Yes, bin laden getting checked for lice on worldwide TV would be
> sweet.
>
>

John HUDSON
December 16th 03, 12:28 AM
On Tue, 16 Dec 2003 02:46:54 +1100, "DRS"
> wrote:

>John HUDSON > wrote in message

>> On Mon, 15 Dec 2003 04:58:04 +1100, "DRS"
>> > wrote:
>>> JC Der Koenig > wrote in message
>>>
>>>> The shortest way between two points is a straight line. Very simple.
>>>
>>> Only if the universe is flat, which it isn't.
>>
>> From a navigation point of view "the shortest way between two points"
>> on a chart is always indicated by a straight line.
>
>Have you ever looked at non-Euclidian geometry? In a curved universe
>straight doesn't necessarily mean what you think it does.

It is necessary only to know about rhumb lines!

"A map with longitude as the x-axis and as the y-axis has a
Mercator[4] projection (with the equator as the standard parallel) on
which rhumb lines plot as straight lines with the correct azimuth."

http://williams.best.vwh.net/ellipsoid/node3.html

August Pamplona
December 16th 03, 12:29 AM
"Top Sirloin" > wrote in message
...
> On 14 Dec 2003 17:18:27 GMT, (Scoot) wrote:
>
> >>
> >>
> >>The best way to fix the problem would be to kill all arabs and
muslims.
> >>Let's get started.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >Good idea. Then George W. Bush will have won his terrorist attack to
take
> >control of the mid-east oil fields....
>
> Uh, if that was his plan why did we just give Iraq control of theirs?
>

When did this happen? Last I heard, it was U.S. politicians rather
than Iraqi politicians who were making decisionas regarding who can or
cannot get oil contracts (i.e. control of the oil fields). This does not
look good and there's no need for it because if they butched up and
shoved their arm up the Iraqi Ruling Council's collective ass while
drinking a glass of water they would have gotten the same result*.

August Pamplona
* From statements made before this whole war thing officially started by
people who I presume would presently control the Iraqi Governing
Council, it was pretty clear who'd be getting the oil contracts if they
had their way.
--
The waterfall in Java is not wet.
- omegazero2003 on m.f.w.

a.a. # 1811 apatriot #20 Eater of smut
To email replace 'necatoramericanusancylostomaduodenale' with
'cosmicaug'

>
> --
>
> Scott Johnson
> "be a man ,stop looking for handouts , eat ,lift and shut your mouth"
> -John Carlo

August Pamplona
December 16th 03, 12:30 AM
"DRS" > wrote in message
...
> John HUDSON > wrote in message
>
> > On Mon, 15 Dec 2003 04:58:04 +1100, "DRS"
> > > wrote:
> >> JC Der Koenig > wrote in message
> >>
> >>> The shortest way between two points is a straight line. Very
simple.
> >>
> >> Only if the universe is flat, which it isn't.
> >
> > From a navigation point of view "the shortest way between two
points"
> > on a chart is always indicated by a straight line.
>
> Have you ever looked at non-Euclidian geometry? In a curved universe
> straight doesn't necessarily mean what you think it does.
>

On the contrary, the shortest way between two points is a straight
line (even if a "straight line" --a line in math talk-- doesn't look
like the way you think it ought to look).

August Pamplona
--
The waterfall in Java is not wet.
- omegazero2003 on m.f.w.

a.a. # 1811 apatriot #20 Eater of smut
To email replace 'necatoramericanusancylostomaduodenale' with
'cosmicaug'

August Pamplona
December 16th 03, 12:30 AM
"Robert Dorf" > wrote in message
...
> On Mon, 15 Dec 2003 02:04:49 +0000 (UTC), Donovan Rebbechi
> > wrote:
>
> >In article <[email protected]_s52>, Lee Michaels wrote:
> >
> >> Many arabs were upset he didn't go out fighting till dead like his
sons did.
> >> They considered what he did cowardly. I wonder how much better it
is for us
> >> that he is alive?
> >
> >Not only do I personally enjoy seeing these tough-talking dictators
cut down
> >to size when they are under the gun, I think getting him like this
really
> >damages his cult-hero status. IOW, it's a big propoganda win, IMO.
> >
> >But the tricky part is, how should he be dealt with ? Whatever means
is used
> >to try him, it must be carried out in a way that's perceived as fair.
If he
> >was tried by Iraqis in Iraq, that could deal a further blow to his
image, as
> >long as the trial wasn't seen as a proxy for some sort of tribal
in-fighting.
> >
> Any trial will be viewed in the Al-Jazeera broadcast area as fixed by
> the Americans. A UN supported trial in Iraq might have some
> diplomatic value in Europe.
> I wonder how long it will take the French government to suggest giving
> him amnesty and a nice pension in exchange for "cooperation."

Now you're being silly, Bob. No pony?

August Pamplona
--
The waterfall in Java is not wet.
- omegazero2003 on m.f.w.

a.a. # 1811 apatriot #20 Eater of smut
To email replace 'necatoramericanusancylostomaduodenale' with
'cosmicaug'

Robert Dorf
December 16th 03, 01:13 AM
On Mon, 15 Dec 2003 18:29:55 -0600, "August Pamplona"
> wrote:

>This does not
>look good and there's no need for it because if they butched up and
>shoved their arm up the Iraqi Ruling Council's collective ass while
>drinking a glass of water they would have gotten the same result*.

Them political types sure do throw interestin' parties.

Robert Dorf
December 16th 03, 01:14 AM
On Mon, 15 Dec 2003 18:30:17 -0600, "August Pamplona"
> wrote:

>"Robert Dorf" > wrote in message
...
>> I wonder how long it will take the French government to suggest giving
>> him amnesty and a nice pension in exchange for "cooperation."
>
> Now you're being silly, Bob. No pony?
>
Quite right August. They'll also need to offer him a pony.

Wayne S. Hill
December 16th 03, 01:48 AM
John HUDSON wrote:

> "DRS" wrote:
>
>>Have you ever looked at non-Euclidian geometry? In a curved
>>universe straight doesn't necessarily mean what you think it
>>does.
>
> It is necessary only to know about rhumb lines!
>
> "A map with longitude as the x-axis and as the y-axis has a
> Mercator[4] projection (with the equator as the standard
> parallel) on which rhumb lines plot as straight lines with
> the correct azimuth."
>
> http://williams.best.vwh.net/ellipsoid/node3.html

Heh: if your space doesn't behave the way you want it to, map it
onto one that does.

--
-Wayne

Proton Soup
December 16th 03, 01:55 AM
On 16 Dec 2003 01:48:28 GMT, "Wayne S. Hill" > wrote:

>John HUDSON wrote:
>
>> "DRS" wrote:
>>
>>>Have you ever looked at non-Euclidian geometry? In a curved
>>>universe straight doesn't necessarily mean what you think it
>>>does.
>>
>> It is necessary only to know about rhumb lines!
>>
>> "A map with longitude as the x-axis and as the y-axis has a
>> Mercator[4] projection (with the equator as the standard
>> parallel) on which rhumb lines plot as straight lines with
>> the correct azimuth."
>>
>> http://williams.best.vwh.net/ellipsoid/node3.html
>
>Heh: if your space doesn't behave the way you want it to, map it
>onto one that does.

Certainly. At least that's the way I had it s-plane'd to me when I
was in school.

Proton Soup

Wayne S. Hill
December 16th 03, 02:02 AM
Proton Soup wrote:

> On 16 Dec 2003 01:48:28 GMT, "Wayne S. Hill"
> > wrote:
>
>>John HUDSON wrote:
>>> "DRS" wrote:
>>>
>>>>Have you ever looked at non-Euclidian geometry? In a
>>>>curved universe straight doesn't necessarily mean what you
>>>>think it does.
>>>
>>> It is necessary only to know about rhumb lines!
>>>
>>> "A map with longitude as the x-axis and as the y-axis has
>>> a Mercator[4] projection (with the equator as the standard
>>> parallel) on which rhumb lines plot as straight lines with
>>> the correct azimuth."
>>>
>>> http://williams.best.vwh.net/ellipsoid/node3.html
>>
>>Heh: if your space doesn't behave the way you want it to,
>>map it onto one that does.
>
> Certainly. At least that's the way I had it s-plane'd to me
> when I was in school.

Ouch...

--
-Wayne

JC Der Koenig
December 16th 03, 03:43 AM
"William Brink" > wrote in message
...
> In article >,
> "JC Der Koenig" > wrote:
>
> > "Scoot" > wrote in message
> > ...
> > > great, that's good to hear. Now I guess we can stop looking for Bin
Laden
> > and
> > > the folks responsible for flying jets into the WTC, the Pentagon, as
well
> > as
> > > the jet the passengers attempted to retake. We'll take the straw man
> > instead
> > > of those actually responsible for 3000 deaths.
> > >
> > > Way to fail gang..
> > >
> > >
> >
> > The best way to fix the problem would be to kill all arabs and muslims.
> > Let's get started.
>
> The best way to fix the prpblem would be to reduce our need for oil.
> There is nothing we could do that would have as great an effect on US
> security.
>

In the mean time, let's just kill all the arabs anyway.

John HUDSON
December 16th 03, 08:31 AM
On 16 Dec 2003 01:48:28 GMT, "Wayne S. Hill" > wrote:

>John HUDSON wrote:
>
>> "DRS" wrote:
>>
>>>Have you ever looked at non-Euclidian geometry? In a curved
>>>universe straight doesn't necessarily mean what you think it
>>>does.
>>
>> It is necessary only to know about rhumb lines!
>>
>> "A map with longitude as the x-axis and as the y-axis has a
>> Mercator[4] projection (with the equator as the standard
>> parallel) on which rhumb lines plot as straight lines with
>> the correct azimuth."
>>
>> http://williams.best.vwh.net/ellipsoid/node3.html
>
>Heh: if your space doesn't behave the way you want it to, map it
>onto one that does.

In keeping with long-standing MFW tradition and practice? ;o)

John HUDSON
December 16th 03, 08:32 AM
On Mon, 15 Dec 2003 19:55:26 -0600, Proton Soup >
wrote:

>On 16 Dec 2003 01:48:28 GMT, "Wayne S. Hill" > wrote:
>
>>John HUDSON wrote:
>>
>>> "DRS" wrote:
>>>
>>>>Have you ever looked at non-Euclidian geometry? In a curved
>>>>universe straight doesn't necessarily mean what you think it
>>>>does.
>>>
>>> It is necessary only to know about rhumb lines!
>>>
>>> "A map with longitude as the x-axis and as the y-axis has a
>>> Mercator[4] projection (with the equator as the standard
>>> parallel) on which rhumb lines plot as straight lines with
>>> the correct azimuth."
>>>
>>> http://williams.best.vwh.net/ellipsoid/node3.html
>>
>>Heh: if your space doesn't behave the way you want it to, map it
>>onto one that does.
>
>Certainly. At least that's the way I had it s-plane'd to me when I
>was in school.

I like this! <G>

>
>Proton Soup

Dally
December 16th 03, 02:36 PM
JC Der Koenig wrote:

> In the mean time, let's just kill all the arabs anyway.

I believe they tried that in Palestine. They kept reproducing and are
now about 6 years from forming a popular majority. Turns out genocide
is a bad plan. (Who knew?)

(Someone much earlier in the thread got squeamish about all this talk of
killing people, even in jest. I'm now joining those ranks.)

Dally, high up on someone's genocide list herself

Robert Dorf
December 16th 03, 02:40 PM
On Tue, 16 Dec 2003 09:36:59 -0500, Dally > wrote:

>JC Der Koenig wrote:
>
>> In the mean time, let's just kill all the arabs anyway.
>
>I believe they tried that in Palestine. They kept reproducing and are
>now about 6 years from forming a popular majority. Turns out genocide
>is a bad plan. (Who knew?)

No, they didn't. You're pretty quick with accusations of attempted
genocide.

Dally
December 16th 03, 04:26 PM
Robert Dorf wrote:
> On Tue, 16 Dec 2003 09:36:59 -0500, Dally > wrote:
>
>
>>JC Der Koenig wrote:
>>
>>
>>>In the mean time, let's just kill all the arabs anyway.
>>
>>I believe they tried that in Palestine. They kept reproducing and are
>>now about 6 years from forming a popular majority. Turns out genocide
>>is a bad plan. (Who knew?)
>
>
> No, they didn't. You're pretty quick with accusations of attempted
> genocide.

Oh, gasp, you mean this thread has degenerated into bad theories?

Dally

gps
December 18th 03, 02:48 PM
Dally wrote:
>
> gps wrote:
>
> > Dally wrote:
> >
> >>Top Sirloin wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>>On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 15:16:53 GMT, "Bill K" > wrote:
> >>>
> >>>>But the one I really want is Bin Laden....
> >>>
> >>>He's dead, Jim.
> >>
> >>I'm sorry, I've seen too many comic books to believe the villain is dead
> >>when he dies outside the scene.
> >>
> >>Dally
> >
> >
> > Your reliance on comic books for your information is amply evidenced by
> > your posts.
> > ps
>
> Oooh, that's almost witty.
>
> Dally

Almost? I guess I should have included a "POW!" or a "KA-BLAM!"
ps

gps
December 18th 03, 03:03 PM
Dally wrote:
>
> gps wrote:
>
> > No one was "victoriously slaughtered," and your choice of language is an
> > insult to those who participated in the raid and who insure your safety
> > with their lives. The people killed in this raid were killed resisting
> > arrest. They could have surrendered without a shot being fired, just as
> > grandpa did, but they chose to resist.
>
> My stance is simply that non-lethal force ought to be used on 14 year
> olds whenever possible.

And you think it possible when a 14 year old is in a fortified room with
armed with assault rifles?

> I agree that "slaughtered" is incendiary. But
> there was great rejoicing over their deaths so I'm going to stick with
> the "victoriously" part.

By whom? You could also define "great rejoicing" so we're on the same
page here.

> Why, did you in your superior news coverage
> hear people saying that it was a shame to kill a kid?

I never claimed my coverage was superior. I believe you willfully
ignore coverage which doesn't align with your pov though. As my sources
were primarily mass media outlets such as CNN, MSNBC, FOX, etc., I find
it very hard to believe you did not have exposure to the same coverage,
yet you claim not to have heard it reported that there were four people
killed, one of them Qusay's, iirc, son.

<snip>
> I live in a small town. Each person's loss diminishes us all. Ask not
> for whom the bell tolls, and all that.

Yes, I thought so. You've probably never been exposed to the depths of
evil some human beings are capable of. You think all anyone needs is a
little love and understanding and they'll be fine. It's nice that you
are able to believe as much, but it would be nice if you showed a bit
more appreciation for those who allow your naiveté to remain unbroken.

> Why, don't you grieve over sad outcomes?

Sure, but I don't see anything sad about people firing on US soldiers
being killed.

> Are you trying to make me into some sort of cop or soldier hater? You'd
> be wrong.
>
> Dally

I'm trying to understand your perspective. Frankly, claiming that these
four people were victoriously slaughtered doesn't sound a whole lot
different to me than a bunch of hippies calling people baby killers.
ps

William Brink
December 20th 03, 02:20 PM
In article >,
gps > wrote:

>
> Yes, I thought so. You've probably never been exposed to the depths of
> evil some human beings are capable of. You think all anyone needs is a
> little love and understanding and they'll be fine. It's nice that you
> are able to believe as much, but it would be nice if you showed a bit
> more appreciation for those who allow your naiveté to remain unbroken.

Only one reason people like him are able to live in that fantasy world:

"We sleep soundly in our beds because rough men stand ready in the night
to visit violence on those who would do us harm." -George Orwell

--
Will Brink

http://www.brinkzone.com/
http://musclebuildingnutrition.com/
http://www.aboutsupplements.com/

ATP
December 21st 03, 01:09 AM
William Brink wrote:
> In article >,
> gps > wrote:
>
>>
>> Yes, I thought so. You've probably never been exposed to the depths
>> of evil some human beings are capable of. You think all anyone
>> needs is a little love and understanding and they'll be fine. It's
>> nice that you are able to believe as much, but it would be nice if
>> you showed a bit more appreciation for those who allow your naiveté
>> to remain unbroken.
>
> Only one reason people like him are able to live in that fantasy
> world:
>
> "We sleep soundly in our beds because rough men stand ready in the
> night to visit violence on those who would do us harm." -George Orwell

Do you fancy yourself one of those "rough men"?

gps
December 21st 03, 03:08 AM
ATP wrote:
>
> William Brink wrote:
> > In article >,
> > gps > wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> Yes, I thought so. You've probably never been exposed to the depths
> >> of evil some human beings are capable of. You think all anyone
> >> needs is a little love and understanding and they'll be fine. It's
> >> nice that you are able to believe as much, but it would be nice if
> >> you showed a bit more appreciation for those who allow your naiveté
> >> to remain unbroken.
> >
> > Only one reason people like him are able to live in that fantasy
> > world:
> >
> > "We sleep soundly in our beds because rough men stand ready in the
> > night to visit violence on those who would do us harm." -George Orwell
>
> Do you fancy yourself one of those "rough men"?

No, you're thinking of Lane.
ps

Dally
December 21st 03, 03:21 AM
gps wrote:

>>>>Yes, I thought so. You've probably never been exposed to the depths
>>>>of evil some human beings are capable of. You think all anyone
>>>>needs is a little love and understanding and they'll be fine. It's
>>>>nice that you are able to believe as much, but it would be nice if
>>>>you showed a bit more appreciation for those who allow your naiveté
>>>>to remain unbroken.

Having pity and thinking people are curable are different things.

Besides, I do show some appreciation. I stood in front of the White
House holding a sign saying, 'I support Bush in Iraq' in September.
I've got jpegs. It isn't true that I support Bush, but I *do* support
my best friend who has a military family and it was the favor she asked
me to do while I was in D.C. So I did. Out of appreciation... and a
quirky sense of humor.

Dally, who voted Republican once when she was young and _______

Lee Michaels
December 21st 03, 09:35 AM
"gps" > wrote in message
...
> ATP wrote:
> >
> > William Brink wrote:
> > > In article >,
> > > gps > wrote:
> > >
> > >>
> > >> Yes, I thought so. You've probably never been exposed to the depths
> > >> of evil some human beings are capable of. You think all anyone
> > >> needs is a little love and understanding and they'll be fine. It's
> > >> nice that you are able to believe as much, but it would be nice if
> > >> you showed a bit more appreciation for those who allow your naiveté
> > >> to remain unbroken.
> > >
> > > Only one reason people like him are able to live in that fantasy
> > > world:
> > >
> > > "We sleep soundly in our beds because rough men stand ready in the
> > > night to visit violence on those who would do us harm." -George Orwell
> >
> > Do you fancy yourself one of those "rough men"?
>
> No, you're thinking of Lane.
> ps

Not John Carlo??

William Brink
December 21st 03, 02:30 PM
In article >,
"ATP" > wrote:

> William Brink wrote:
> > In article >,
> > gps > wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> Yes, I thought so. You've probably never been exposed to the depths
> >> of evil some human beings are capable of. You think all anyone
> >> needs is a little love and understanding and they'll be fine. It's
> >> nice that you are able to believe as much, but it would be nice if
> >> you showed a bit more appreciation for those who allow your naiveté
> >> to remain unbroken.
> >
> > Only one reason people like him are able to live in that fantasy
> > world:
> >
> > "We sleep soundly in our beds because rough men stand ready in the
> > night to visit violence on those who would do us harm." -George Orwell
>
> Do you fancy yourself one of those "rough men"?

I fail to see how one would make that connection because I quote Orwell.

--
Will Brink

http://www.brinkzone.com/
http://musclebuildingnutrition.com/
http://www.aboutsupplements.com/