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View Full Version : A 3-week program for increasing my clean: comments?


george
January 24th 07, 03:36 PM
The goal of this high-volume program is to improve my clean (current
1RM about 100kg). And if I want to do other things (squat, dl, bench) I
am supposed to do it on other days.

On paper, it looks just too easy... Any comments?

Here it is, it table format:

http://tinypic.com/view/?pic=2i91g01

Hobbes
January 24th 07, 04:24 PM
In article . com>,
"george" > wrote:

> The goal of this high-volume program is to improve my clean (current
> 1RM about 100kg). And if I want to do other things (squat, dl, bench) I
> am supposed to do it on other days.
>
> On paper, it looks just too easy... Any comments?
>
> Here it is, it table format:
>
> http://tinypic.com/view/?pic=2i91g01
>

Nothing wrong with it.

IMO there are really only a few worthwhile assistance exercises.
Anything from the blocks or hang is just fine. Hi-pulls. Front squats or
squats. You could also argue power cleans.

If you break down the movement and the adaptations into functional
adaptations and say all the movements have to be specific to the clean
than you really have everything.

Hang clean and clean from the blocks are technique exercises to focus on
maximal vertical extension.

Hi-pulls are a strength exercise focusing on pull.

Front squat is a strength exercise focusing on catch and recovery to
stand.

I'd argue for the power clean as a speed exercise to focus on bar speed.
I know there are a number of articles which dispute this and feel the
technique is too different, including some written by the great lifter
and coach Tommy Kono. But so many great lifters have used the power
clean with good results.

--
Keith

george
January 24th 07, 04:31 PM
BTW, RDL=Romanian Dead Lift

On Jan 24, 11:24 am, Hobbes > wrote:

>Nothing wrong with it.

It just seems too light in terms of amount of work...but maybe I'm
wrong

> I'd argue for the power clean as a speed exercise to focus on bar speed.

How is the power clean different from the clean part of the clean &
jerk?


Thanks.

Hobbes
January 24th 07, 04:42 PM
In article . com>,
"george" > wrote:

> BTW, RDL=Romanian Dead Lift
>
> On Jan 24, 11:24 am, Hobbes > wrote:
>
> >Nothing wrong with it.
>
> It just seems too light in terms of amount of work...but maybe I'm
> wrong
>
> > I'd argue for the power clean as a speed exercise to focus on bar speed.
>
> How is the power clean different from the clean part of the clean &
> jerk?

Yeah. I don't mind that either, although I would argue that hi-pulls
stress the musculature involved enough that the RDL is a little
redundant.

In the power clean the bar is pulled much higher and there is a much
smaller drop on the catch. Kono felt it was too light and too different
and didn't translate into a better clean. OTOH, if you think of training
speed it makes some sense.

--
Keith

Andrzej Rosa
January 25th 07, 01:37 PM
Dnia 2007-01-24 george napisał(a):
> BTW, RDL=Romanian Dead Lift
>
> On Jan 24, 11:24 am, Hobbes > wrote:
>
>>Nothing wrong with it.
>
> It just seems too light in terms of amount of work...but maybe I'm
> wrong

Well, it does seem to be low volume to me, and it doesn't have squat
cleans at all. What also looks strange to me is 72 hours between
workouts _minimum_.

>> I'd argue for the power clean as a speed exercise to focus on bar speed.
>
> How is the power clean different from the clean part of the clean &
> jerk?

It doesn't involve get-under-the-bar-FAST part. It takes a lot of
coordination to execute a clean well, especially when double knee
extension enters the picture. To be good at reversing motion fast, one
needs to train for it.

--
Andrzej Rosa

george
January 25th 07, 01:54 PM
On Jan 25, 8:37 am, Andrzej Rosa > wrote:

> Well, it does seem to be low volume to me, and it doesn't have squat
> cleans at all.

I'll ask my PT about them.

> What also looks strange to me is 72 hours between
> workouts _minimum_.

Yesterday I did 'day 1', and the clean pulls from the floor with 90 kg
followed by 5x5 front squats with 100 kg
KILLED me. I am really going to need 3 days to recover. In the future I
may bench in between clean training days.

> coordination to execute a clean well, especially when double knee
> extension enters the picture.

Double knee extension? Are you talking about the knee extension
involved in the pull?

Thanks for the feedback.

Andrzej Rosa
January 25th 07, 02:29 PM
Dnia 2007-01-25 george napisał(a):
> On Jan 25, 8:37 am, Andrzej Rosa > wrote:
>
>> Well, it does seem to be low volume to me, and it doesn't have squat
>> cleans at all.
>
> I'll ask my PT about them.

Chances are that he knows what he is doing better that any of us can
know about what you are doing (wrong).

>> What also looks strange to me is 72 hours between
>> workouts _minimum_.
>
> Yesterday I did 'day 1', and the clean pulls from the floor with 90 kg
> followed by 5x5 front squats with 100 kg
> KILLED me. I am really going to need 3 days to recover. In the future I
> may bench in between clean training days.

If you are doing some Oly lifting just to supplement your general
strength program lower frequency makes sense.

>> coordination to execute a clean well, especially when double knee
>> extension enters the picture.
>
> Double knee extension? Are you talking about the knee extension
> involved in the pull?

In pulls. They are plural. You extend the knee during your first
pull, from the floor to above the knees. Then you bend your knees back
a bit and you do your second pull from a hang position. Watch closely
the videos of good lifters and you'll see it, but it's not a thing you
must worry about if some other and more obvious technical flaws are at
stakes.

Anyway, what I meant is that the difference of power clean and squat
clean is mostly of technical nature, and at some point doing power
cleans often becomes counterproductive.

> Thanks for the feedback.

Well, if I had a coach I'd do what he says. If he trained some people
at Oly stuff, he may simply know better what works and what doesn't, so
follow his program and do not worry about details.

--
Andrzej Rosa

george
January 25th 07, 03:02 PM
On Jan 25, 9:29 am, Andrzej Rosa > wrote:

> You extend the knee during your first
> pull, from the floor to above the knees. Then you bend your knees back
> a bit and you do your second pull from a hang position.

I've been doing that, actually.