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bob
January 6th 08, 09:09 PM
Does anyone have any good tips on how to enlarge calves?
I have been doing 300lb calf-presses - 5 sets of 12 reps per session - for 3
years now and it has made no difference to the size of my calves. I still
have chicken legs!!! Have to say the muscles are good however the size is
pathetic.
Any ideas...please! - am frustrated.

jcderkoeing
January 6th 08, 09:25 PM
"bob" > wrote in message ...
> Does anyone have any good tips on how to enlarge calves?
> I have been doing 300lb calf-presses - 5 sets of 12 reps per session - for
> 3 years now and it has made no difference to the size of my calves. I
> still have chicken legs!!! Have to say the muscles are good however the
> size is pathetic.
> Any ideas...please! - am frustrated.
>

Airborne shuffle for extended time.

Curt
January 6th 08, 09:25 PM
On Jan 6, 4:09 pm, "bob" > wrote:
> Does anyone have any good tips on how to enlarge calves?
> I have been doing 300lb calf-presses - 5 sets of 12 reps per session - for 3
> years now and it has made no difference to the size of my calves. I still
> have chicken legs!!! Have to say the muscles are good however the size is
> pathetic.
> Any ideas...please! - am frustrated.

How much has your bodyweight gone up during those three years?

My calves are, I'm sure, equally qualified for the "chicken legs"
title, however they have grown simply from gaining weight. Up your
calories, up your protein, up your calf size.

You might also try a reduced weight, say, 200 pounds for 10 sets of 20
reps to shake things up. Pause at the top and do all the other tips
and tricks recommended in the bodybuilding mags - toes pointed in,
out, backwards, upside-down, etc.

Get a pair of those calf shoes that Boyer Coe was selling years ago. I
think they might be available on eBay.

Best of luck.

--
Curt

Steve Freides
January 6th 08, 09:53 PM
"bob" > wrote in message
...
> Does anyone have any good tips on how to enlarge calves?
> I have been doing 300lb calf-presses - 5 sets of 12 reps per session -
> for 3 years now and it has made no difference to the size of my
> calves. I still have chicken legs!!! Have to say the muscles are good
> however the size is pathetic.
> Any ideas...please! - am frustrated.

I have heard that this is one of those things that's largely genetic -
you need to pick different parents. I have very small calf muscles, and
the only thing that ever put any size on them was riding a bicycle a lot
using a modern "clipless" pedal system that encourages one to pull up
and back on the pedals, requiring the calf muscles as stabilizers.

Just my opinion.

-S-
http://www.kbnj.com

Hobbes
January 6th 08, 10:12 PM
In article >, "bob" > wrote:

> Does anyone have any good tips on how to enlarge calves?
> I have been doing 300lb calf-presses - 5 sets of 12 reps per session - for 3
> years now and it has made no difference to the size of my calves. I still
> have chicken legs!!! Have to say the muscles are good however the size is
> pathetic.
> Any ideas...please! - am frustrated.

Skipping rope. Seriously.

--
Keith

Curt
January 6th 08, 11:24 PM
On Jan 6, 5:12 pm, Hobbes > wrote:
> In article >, "bob" > wrote:
> > Does anyone have any good tips on how to enlarge calves?
> > I have been doing 300lb calf-presses - 5 sets of 12 reps per session - for 3
> > years now and it has made no difference to the size of my calves. I still
> > have chicken legs!!! Have to say the muscles are good however the size is
> > pathetic.
> > Any ideas...please! - am frustrated.
>
> Skipping rope. Seriously.

Which is akin to bodyweight, high-rep, rapid-fire calf raises! :o)

--
Curt

January 7th 08, 12:52 AM
On Jan 6, 3:09 pm, "bob" > wrote:
> Does anyone have any good tips on how to enlarge calves?
> I have been doing 300lb calf-presses - 5 sets of 12 reps per session - for 3
> years now and it has made no difference to the size of my calves. I still
> have chicken legs!!! Have to say the muscles are good however the size is
> pathetic.
> Any ideas...please! - am frustrated.

DNA Splicing with a Polynesian or PAW. Or similar.

spodosaurus
January 7th 08, 02:21 AM
bob wrote:
> Does anyone have any good tips on how to enlarge calves?
> I have been doing 300lb calf-presses - 5 sets of 12 reps per session - for 3
> years now and it has made no difference to the size of my calves. I still
> have chicken legs!!! Have to say the muscles are good however the size is
> pathetic.
> Any ideas...please! - am frustrated.

Keep feeding them until they reach maturity. Don't try to lift a bull by
grabbing it in the 'wrong place'.

Ari


--
spammage trappage: remove the underscores to reply
Many people around the world are waiting for a marrow transplant. Please
volunteer to be a marrow donor and literally save someone's life:
http://www.abmdr.org.au/
http://www.marrow.org/

Prisoner at War
January 7th 08, 03:30 AM
On Jan 6, 4:09 pm, "bob" > wrote:
> Does anyone have any good tips on how to enlarge calves?
> I have been doing 300lb calf-presses - 5 sets of 12 reps per session - for 3
> years now and it has made no difference to the size of my calves. I still
> have chicken legs!!! Have to say the muscles are good however the size is
> pathetic.
> Any ideas...please! - am frustrated.

Get reincarnated as an Asian or Samoan islander.

In the here and now, if you've been diligent all these years and you
ain't getting results, then obviously it's genetics.

Don't be frustrated. If everyone looked a certain way, guess what,
the topic of the day would be how to look different -- "my calves are
too big" (seriously, TIME magazine had a story years ago on Japanese
getting calf surgery so that they can sport elongated calves like
Euros -- people are ****ing stupid; don't be an idiot; use what God
gave you).

Manco
January 7th 08, 06:13 AM
bob wrote:
> Does anyone have any good tips on how to enlarge calves?
> I have been doing 300lb calf-presses - 5 sets of 12 reps per session
> - for 3 years now and it has made no difference to the size of my
> calves. I still have chicken legs!!! Have to say the muscles are good
> however the size is pathetic.
> Any ideas...please! - am frustrated.

Genetics have much to do with this. Don't beat yourself up for something
that might be unattainable.

Manco
January 7th 08, 06:14 AM
Prisoner at War wrote:
>
> Don't be frustrated. If everyone looked a certain way, guess what,
> the topic of the day would be how to look different -- "my calves are
> too big" (seriously, TIME magazine had a story years ago on Japanese
> getting calf surgery so that they can sport elongated calves like
> Euros -- people are ****ing stupid; don't be an idiot; use what God
> gave you).

Yeah since when are Euros the standard of beauty anyways? Personally I think
Japanese women are much more attractive.

Prisoner at War
January 7th 08, 03:25 PM
On Jan 7, 1:14 am, "Manco" > wrote:
>
>
> Yeah since when are Euros the standard of beauty anyways? Personally I think
> Japanese women are much more attractive.

It's pretty sick, but hilarious that those Japs are snipping their
calf tendons in order to elongate their calf muscles while Euros are
wondering why their calf muscles can't bulk up!

Spammers_Should_Be_Shot[_2_]
January 7th 08, 06:37 PM
"Rob Schuh" > wrote in message
...
> Manco" > wrote in message
> news:[email protected]
> > bob wrote:
> >> Does anyone have any good tips on how to enlarge calves?
> >> I have been doing 300lb calf-presses - 5 sets of 12 reps per session
> >> - for 3 years now and it has made no difference to the size of my
> >> calves. I still have chicken legs!!! Have to say the muscles are good
> >> however the size is pathetic.
> >> Any ideas...please! - am frustrated.
> >
> > Genetics have much to do with this. Don't beat yourself up for something
> > that might be unattainable.
> >
>
> The guy is not training his calves hard enough. How do you know if your
> genetics are good or bad unless you train them correctly?
>
> --
> Robert Schuh
> "Everything that elevates an individual above the herd and
> intimidates the neighbour is henceforth called evil; and
> the fair, modest, submissive and conforming mentality,
> the mediocrity of desires attains moral designations and honors"
> - Nietzsche
>
> http://www.hardbopdrums.com/
>
>

I hate to agree with "post your real name you #%@!%*&" Rob but i will.
Everyone is saying genetics (which is a limiting factor but I doubt he's at
his limit). He originally stated "300lb calf-presses - 5 sets of 12 reps
per session for 3 years now". If you're not getting the results you want
you should change something (i.e. diet, reps, weight, etc.). Without
knowing much about you - I'd suggest 60reps is too high. I'd try 3sets of
7-9reps (with higher weight) for a month and see what happens. Also, in
another post you mention your calorie intake, it sounds low for muscles
building (but I can't confirm that without more info).

bob
January 7th 08, 06:47 PM
jcderkoeing wrote:
> "bob" > wrote in message
> ...
>> Does anyone have any good tips on how to enlarge calves?
>> I have been doing 300lb calf-presses - 5 sets of 12 reps per session
>> - for 3 years now and it has made no difference to the size of my
>> calves. I still have chicken legs!!! Have to say the muscles are
>> good however the size is pathetic.
>> Any ideas...please! - am frustrated.
>>
>
> Airborne shuffle for extended time.

Pardon my ignorance..what is "airborne shuffle"?

bob
January 7th 08, 06:52 PM
Curt wrote:
> On Jan 6, 4:09 pm, "bob" > wrote:
>> Does anyone have any good tips on how to enlarge calves?
>> I have been doing 300lb calf-presses - 5 sets of 12 reps per session
>> - for 3 years now and it has made no difference to the size of my
>> calves. I still have chicken legs!!! Have to say the muscles are
>> good however the size is pathetic.
>> Any ideas...please! - am frustrated.
>
> How much has your bodyweight gone up during those three years?
>
> My calves are, I'm sure, equally qualified for the "chicken legs"
> title, however they have grown simply from gaining weight. Up your
> calories, up your protein, up your calf size.

I used to see other guys with massively developed upper bodies....and
chicken legs. I dont want to look like that, however I am more athletic than
muscular.
Im trying to contro my calory intake - keep to 1600 a day. Why would an
increase improve my calves?
>
> You might also try a reduced weight, say, 200 pounds for 10 sets of 20
> reps to shake things up. Pause at the top and do all the other tips
> and tricks recommended in the bodybuilding mags - toes pointed in,
> out, backwards, upside-down, etc.
>
> Get a pair of those calf shoes that Boyer Coe was selling years ago. I
> think they might be available on eBay.
>
> Best of luck.

bob
January 7th 08, 06:54 PM
wrote:
> On Jan 6, 3:09 pm, "bob" > wrote:
>> Does anyone have any good tips on how to enlarge calves?
>> I have been doing 300lb calf-presses - 5 sets of 12 reps per session
>> - for 3 years now and it has made no difference to the size of my
>> calves. I still have chicken legs!!! Have to say the muscles are
>> good however the size is pathetic.
>> Any ideas...please! - am frustrated.
>
> DNA Splicing with a Polynesian or PAW. Or similar.

I see....ok PAW, im coming over to collect some DNA...ok

bob
January 7th 08, 07:00 PM
Prisoner at War wrote:
> On Jan 6, 4:09 pm, "bob" > wrote:
>> Does anyone have any good tips on how to enlarge calves?
>> I have been doing 300lb calf-presses - 5 sets of 12 reps per session
>> - for 3 years now and it has made no difference to the size of my
>> calves. I still have chicken legs!!! Have to say the muscles are
>> good however the size is pathetic.
>> Any ideas...please! - am frustrated.
>
> Get reincarnated as an Asian or Samoan islander.
>
> In the here and now, if you've been diligent all these years and you
> ain't getting results, then obviously it's genetics.

Genetics might be the reason, however both brothers have good sized
calves...and other parts.
>
> Don't be frustrated. If everyone looked a certain way, guess what,
> the topic of the day would be how to look different -- "my calves are
> too big" (seriously, TIME magazine had a story years ago on Japanese
> getting calf surgery so that they can sport elongated calves like
> Euros -- people are ****ing stupid; don't be an idiot; use what God
> gave you).

I was hoping for more encouraging feeback, like, work harder, use heavier
weights...lol.
Guess I'll just have to accept my "chicken legs" and continue......
Calf surgery? are they mad????

bob
January 7th 08, 07:01 PM
Prisoner at War wrote:
> On Jan 7, 1:14 am, "Manco" > wrote:
>>
>>
>> Yeah since when are Euros the standard of beauty anyways? Personally
>> I think Japanese women are much more attractive.
>
> It's pretty sick, but hilarious that those Japs are snipping their
> calf tendons in order to elongate their calf muscles while Euros are
> wondering why their calf muscles can't bulk up!

I want calves like Erik Fankhouser - his are awesome...massive!..Maybe I
need his DNA?

bob
January 7th 08, 07:02 PM
Manco wrote:
> bob wrote:
>> Does anyone have any good tips on how to enlarge calves?
>> I have been doing 300lb calf-presses - 5 sets of 12 reps per session
>> - for 3 years now and it has made no difference to the size of my
>> calves. I still have chicken legs!!! Have to say the muscles are good
>> however the size is pathetic.
>> Any ideas...please! - am frustrated.
>
> Genetics have much to do with this. Don't beat yourself up for
> something that might be unattainable.

The consensus seems to state genetics....damn!!
I want other parents...and now!

Prisoner at War
January 7th 08, 07:50 PM
On Jan 7, 2:00 pm, "bob" > wrote:
>
>
> Genetics might be the reason, however both brothers have good sized
> calves...and other parts.

Maybe it's time for a paternity test?? ;-)

You should also note the distinction between "show muscles" and "work
muscles." There are fat guys who run much faster than me, skinny guys
who lift much more than me, etc.

> I was hoping for more encouraging feeback, like, work harder, use heavier
> weights...lol.

I'm assuming you're already doing the best you can. Then again,
people are usually a lot more capable than they think. The literature
is full of such stories: nobody was able to do a sub-4 mile, but once
one person did it, right away people started doing it...same thing
with the >500-lb. clean (or snatch? Something like that): as soon as
some Russian or Bulgarian guy did it, the next month or something,
everyone else started doing it, too....

> Guess I'll just have to accept my "chicken legs" and continue......
> Calf surgery? are they mad????

Stupid as a doorknob.

Prisoner at War
January 7th 08, 07:58 PM
On Jan 7, 2:01 pm, "bob" > wrote:
>
>
> I want calves like Erik Fankhouser - his are awesome...massive!..Maybe I
> need his DNA?

Maybe you just need to hire his photographer! Bodybuilding is first
and foremost about illusion.

Curt
January 7th 08, 08:16 PM
On Jan 7, 1:52*pm, "bob" > wrote:
> Curt wrote:
> > On Jan 6, 4:09 pm, "bob" > wrote:
> >> Does anyone have any good tips on how to enlarge calves?
> >> I have been doing 300lb calf-presses - 5 sets of 12 reps per session
> >> - for 3 years now and it has made no difference to the size of my
> >> calves. I still have chicken legs!!! Have to say the muscles are
> >> good however the size is pathetic.
> >> Any ideas...please! - am frustrated.
>
> > How much has your bodyweight gone up during those three years?
>
> > My calves are, I'm sure, equally qualified for the "chicken legs"
> > title, however they have grown simply from gaining weight. Up your
> > calories, up your protein, up your calf size.
>
> I used to see other guys with massively developed upper bodies....and
> chicken legs. I dont want to look like that, however I am more athletic than
> muscular.
> Im trying to contro my calory intake - keep to 1600 a day. Why would an
> increase improve my calves?

Sixteen hundred calories a day is next to starvation. I was on 1500
per day from August to November and it wasn't all that much fun.
What's your height and weight currently?

Why would an increase improve your calves? Because you'd be able to
fuel more intense workouts and also because the increase in bodyweight
would - given adequate and intense exercise - result in an increase in
size throughout your body and not just at your waistline.

Old school bodybuilding author Bradley J. Steiner stated that to gain
an inch on a person's biceps or flexed arm measurement that it would
be necessary to gain about ten to fifteen pounds of bodyweight. I am
assuming that this would translate to calves as well as your upper
limbs. Naturally, you'll have to exercise your calves and, again, I'd
recommend you shake things up if you haven't already. Stick with the
same program for three years without results? I hope not.

> > You might also try a reduced weight, say, 200 pounds for 10 sets of 20
> > reps to shake things up. Pause at the top and do all the other tips
> > and tricks recommended in the bodybuilding mags - toes pointed in,
> > out, backwards, upside-down, etc.
>
> > Get a pair of those calf shoes that Boyer Coe was selling years ago. I
> > think they might be available on eBay.
>
> > Best of luck.

--
Curt

David
January 7th 08, 08:25 PM
"Curt" > wrote in message
...
On Jan 7, 1:52 pm, "bob" > wrote:
> Curt wrote:
> > On Jan 6, 4:09 pm, "bob" > wrote:
> >> Does anyone have any good tips on how to enlarge calves?
> >> I have been doing 300lb calf-presses - 5 sets of 12 reps per session
> >> - for 3 years now and it has made no difference to the size of my
> >> calves. I still have chicken legs!!! Have to say the muscles are
> >> good however the size is pathetic.
> >> Any ideas...please! - am frustrated.
>
> > How much has your bodyweight gone up during those three years?
>
> > My calves are, I'm sure, equally qualified for the "chicken legs"
> > title, however they have grown simply from gaining weight. Up your
> > calories, up your protein, up your calf size.
>
> I used to see other guys with massively developed upper bodies....and
> chicken legs. I dont want to look like that, however I am more athletic
> than
> muscular.
> Im trying to contro my calory intake - keep to 1600 a day. Why would an
> increase improve my calves?

Sixteen hundred calories a day is next to starvation. I was on 1500
per day from August to November and it wasn't all that much fun.
What's your height and weight currently?

Why would an increase improve your calves? Because you'd be able to
fuel more intense workouts and also because the increase in bodyweight
would - given adequate and intense exercise - result in an increase in
size throughout your body and not just at your waistline.

Old school bodybuilding author Bradley J. Steiner stated that to gain
an inch on a person's biceps or flexed arm measurement that it would
be necessary to gain about ten to fifteen pounds of bodyweight. I am
assuming that this would translate to calves as well as your upper
limbs. Naturally, you'll have to exercise your calves and, again, I'd
recommend you shake things up if you haven't already. Stick with the
same program for three years without results? I hope not.

Curt, that is very good advice.
By the way, Ichnat thinks your Harley doesn't really belong to you. That
your next door neighbour lets you sit on it and you have your photo taken on
a tripod remote snap. I told him I didn't think that was the case and I was,
you know, pretty loyal to you as we are friends. So, what;s the deal
it is true that you sit on your neighbours Harley?

> > You might also try a reduced weight, say, 200 pounds for 10 sets of 20
> > reps to shake things up. Pause at the top and do all the other tips
> > and tricks recommended in the bodybuilding mags - toes pointed in,
> > out, backwards, upside-down, etc.
>
> > Get a pair of those calf shoes that Boyer Coe was selling years ago. I
> > think they might be available on eBay.
>
> > Best of luck.

--
Curt

Sid Bonfire[_2_]
January 7th 08, 09:43 PM
On Jan 7, 3:25 pm, "David" > wrote:
> "Curt" > wrote in message
>
> ...
> On Jan 7, 1:52 pm, "bob" > wrote:
>
>
>
> > Curt wrote:
> > > On Jan 6, 4:09 pm, "bob" > wrote:
> > >> Does anyone have any good tips on how to enlarge calves?
> > >> I have been doing 300lb calf-presses - 5 sets of 12 reps per session
> > >> - for 3 years now and it has made no difference to the size of my
> > >> calves. I still have chicken legs!!! Have to say the muscles are
> > >> good however the size is pathetic.
> > >> Any ideas...please! - am frustrated.
>
> > > How much has your bodyweight gone up during those three years?
>
> > > My calves are, I'm sure, equally qualified for the "chicken legs"
> > > title, however they have grown simply from gaining weight. Up your
> > > calories, up your protein, up your calf size.
>
> > I used to see other guys with massively developed upper bodies....and
> > chicken legs. I dont want to look like that, however I am more athletic
> > than
> > muscular.
> > Im trying to contro my calory intake - keep to 1600 a day. Why would an
> > increase improve my calves?
>
> Sixteen hundred calories a day is next to starvation. I was on 1500
> per day from August to November and it wasn't all that much fun.
> What's your height and weight currently?
>
> Why would an increase improve your calves? Because you'd be able to
> fuel more intense workouts and also because the increase in bodyweight
> would - given adequate and intense exercise - result in an increase in
> size throughout your body and not just at your waistline.
>
> Old school bodybuilding author Bradley J. Steiner stated that to gain
> an inch on a person's biceps or flexed arm measurement that it would
> be necessary to gain about ten to fifteen pounds of bodyweight. I am
> assuming that this would translate to calves as well as your upper
> limbs. Naturally, you'll have to exercise your calves and, again, I'd
> recommend you shake things up if you haven't already. Stick with the
> same program for three years without results? I hope not.
>
> Curt, that is very good advice.
> By the way, Ichnat thinks your Harley doesn't really belong to you. That
> your next door neighbour lets you sit on it and you have your photo taken on
> a tripod remote snap. I told him I didn't think that was the case and I was,
> you know, pretty loyal to you as we are friends. So, what;s the deal
> it is true that you sit on your neighbours Harley?
>
> > > You might also try a reduced weight, say, 200 pounds for 10 sets of 20
> > > reps to shake things up. Pause at the top and do all the other tips
> > > and tricks recommended in the bodybuilding mags - toes pointed in,
> > > out, backwards, upside-down, etc.
>
> > > Get a pair of those calf shoes that Boyer Coe was selling years ago. I
> > > think they might be available on eBay.
>
> > > Best of luck.
>
> --
> Curt

Squats and dead lifts make everything grow bigger.

Curt
January 8th 08, 01:22 AM
On Jan 7, 3:25 pm, "David" > wrote:
[...]

> Ichnat thinks your Harley doesn't really belong to you. That
> your next door neighbour lets you sit on it and you have your photo taken on
> a tripod remote snap. I told him I didn't think that was the case and I was,
> you know, pretty loyal to you as we are friends. So, what;s the deal
> it is true that you sit on your neighbours Harley?

Come on, David! It's Ichnat's Harley. They're just tooting their own
horn. THANKS FOR LETTING ME SIT ON YOUR HARLEY, ICHNAT!

True story... (have I shared this?) I drove by my bike recently and
did a doubletake. Where my motorcycle had been parked was another
motorcycle - this one covered by a Harley bike cover.

It was my bike!

I found a note on the seat that read "HAPPY HOLIDAYS! FELLOW BIKER"

Now if that don't beat all.

(Well, Kim Basinger throwing herself at me would pretty much beat all,
but a free bike cover during a winter ice storm is on the top 20 at
least.)

WAS IT YOU, ICHNAT? THANKS FOR THE BIKE COVER, "BRO!"

Hey, while I'm here, David, have you sent in your fee for the USS
Maddox reunion? I salute you and Australian advisors everywhere. Your
service to the planet deserves the utmost respect and admiration.

--
Curt

Curt
January 8th 08, 01:26 AM
On Jan 7, 4:43 pm, Sid Bonfire > wrote:
[...]

> Squats and dead lifts make everything grow bigger.

That's not what Howard Stern was ranting about during his show on
personal trainers!

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=ea950a6625

Or something like that.

--
Curt

Sid Bonfire[_2_]
January 8th 08, 01:53 AM
On Jan 7, 8:26 pm, Curt > wrote:
> On Jan 7, 4:43 pm, Sid Bonfire > wrote:
> [...]
>
> > Squats and dead lifts make everything grow bigger.
>
> That's not what Howard Stern was ranting about during his show on
> personal trainers!
>
> http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=ea950a6625
>
> Or something like that.
>
> --
> Curt

Hey Curt, you haven't been lurking over at my other hangout, soloacts?
We've got an asshole from Australia who claims bodybuilders are "300
lb bombs with 3" fuses!"

Rob Schuh
January 8th 08, 02:42 AM
Steve Freides" > wrote in message
...
> "bob" > wrote in message ...
>> Does anyone have any good tips on how to enlarge calves?
>> I have been doing 300lb calf-presses - 5 sets of 12 reps per session -
>> for 3 years now and it has made no difference to the size of my calves. I
>> still have chicken legs!!! Have to say the muscles are good however the
>> size is pathetic.
>> Any ideas...please! - am frustrated.
>
> I have heard that this is one of those things that's largely genetic - you
> need to pick different parents. I have very small calf muscles, and the
> only thing that ever put any size on them was riding a bicycle a lot using
> a modern "clipless" pedal system that encourages one to pull up and back
> on the pedals, requiring the calf muscles as stabilizers.
>
> Just my opinion.
>
> -S-
> http://www.kbnj.com
>
>

Genetics play a huge role in having good calves, but you have to train the
**** out of them to find out if you have decent genetics. If you saw my
calves when I started to train, you would have thought I could not have good
calves, but after years of beating the **** out of them, they eventually
were one of my better bodyparts.


--
Robert Schuh
"Everything that elevates an individual above the herd and
intimidates the neighbour is henceforth called evil; and
the fair, modest, submissive and conforming mentality,
the mediocrity of desires attains moral designations and honors"
- Nietzsche

http://www.hardbopdrums.com/

jcderkoeing
January 8th 08, 02:55 AM
"bob" > wrote in message ...
> jcderkoeing wrote:
>> "bob" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> Does anyone have any good tips on how to enlarge calves?
>>> I have been doing 300lb calf-presses - 5 sets of 12 reps per session
>>> - for 3 years now and it has made no difference to the size of my
>>> calves. I still have chicken legs!!! Have to say the muscles are
>>> good however the size is pathetic.
>>> Any ideas...please! - am frustrated.
>>>
>>
>> Airborne shuffle for extended time.
>
> Pardon my ignorance..what is "airborne shuffle"?
>

A military slow jog that can be done for extendend ranges. Wear boots and a
backpack for even greater effect.

Rob Schuh
January 8th 08, 03:34 AM
Manco" > wrote in message
news:[email protected]
> bob wrote:
>> Does anyone have any good tips on how to enlarge calves?
>> I have been doing 300lb calf-presses - 5 sets of 12 reps per session
>> - for 3 years now and it has made no difference to the size of my
>> calves. I still have chicken legs!!! Have to say the muscles are good
>> however the size is pathetic.
>> Any ideas...please! - am frustrated.
>
> Genetics have much to do with this. Don't beat yourself up for something
> that might be unattainable.
>

The guy is not training his calves hard enough. How do you know if your
genetics are good or bad unless you train them correctly?

--
Robert Schuh
"Everything that elevates an individual above the herd and
intimidates the neighbour is henceforth called evil; and
the fair, modest, submissive and conforming mentality,
the mediocrity of desires attains moral designations and honors"
- Nietzsche

http://www.hardbopdrums.com/

David
January 8th 08, 11:32 AM
"Curt" > wrote in message
...
> On Jan 7, 3:25 pm, "David" > wrote:
> [...]
>
>> Ichnat thinks your Harley doesn't really belong to you. That
>> your next door neighbour lets you sit on it and you have your photo taken
>> on
>> a tripod remote snap. I told him I didn't think that was the case and I
>> was,
>> you know, pretty loyal to you as we are friends. So, what;s the deal
>> it is true that you sit on your neighbours Harley?
>
> Come on, David! It's Ichnat's Harley. They're just tooting their own
> horn. THANKS FOR LETTING ME SIT ON YOUR HARLEY, ICHNAT!
>
> True story... (have I shared this?) I drove by my bike recently and
> did a doubletake. Where my motorcycle had been parked was another
> motorcycle - this one covered by a Harley bike cover.
>
> It was my bike!
>
> I found a note on the seat that read "HAPPY HOLIDAYS! FELLOW BIKER"

Wow! What a decent guy!
>
> Now if that don't beat all.
>
> (Well, Kim Basinger throwing herself at me would pretty much beat all,
> but a free bike cover during a winter ice storm is on the top 20 at
> least.)

Would Rob Shue throwing himself at you make anywhere near the top 20?

>
> WAS IT YOU, ICHNAT? THANKS FOR THE BIKE COVER, "BRO!"

I doubt very much it was Ichnat - seeing as he doesn't believe you really do
*own* a Harley - (nice of your neighbour to let you sit on his bike - does
he ever turn on the motor for you?)

> \
> Hey, while I'm here, David, have you sent in your fee for the USS
> Maddox reunion?

No and there is a simple reason for this. My pocket money is generally kept
in my right pocket. Since I no longer have the use of my right arm, there is
no way for me to access the money required to pay the fee. I asked a lady at
the bus stop if she could reach into my right pocket to remove the money and
I got a slap in the face for my effort.

>I salute you and Australian advisors everywhere. Your
> service to the planet deserves the utmost respect and admiration.

Somehow I doubt your sincerity.
>
> --
> Curt

Mike
January 8th 08, 09:05 PM
bob wrote:
> Prisoner at War wrote:
>> On Jan 7, 1:14 am, "Manco" > wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> Yeah since when are Euros the standard of beauty anyways? Personally
>>> I think Japanese women are much more attractive.
>>
>> It's pretty sick, but hilarious that those Japs are snipping their
>> calf tendons in order to elongate their calf muscles while Euros are
>> wondering why their calf muscles can't bulk up!
>
> I want calves like Erik Fankhouser - his are
> awesome...massive!..Maybe I need his DNA?

I think you like more than his calves....his bulge, right. Now there is some
hot DNA

Mike
January 8th 08, 09:07 PM
bob wrote:
> Curt wrote:
>> On Jan 6, 4:09 pm, "bob" > wrote:
>>> Does anyone have any good tips on how to enlarge calves?
>>> I have been doing 300lb calf-presses - 5 sets of 12 reps per session
>>> - for 3 years now and it has made no difference to the size of my
>>> calves. I still have chicken legs!!! Have to say the muscles are
>>> good however the size is pathetic.
>>> Any ideas...please! - am frustrated.
>>
>> How much has your bodyweight gone up during those three years?
>>
>> My calves are, I'm sure, equally qualified for the "chicken legs"
>> title, however they have grown simply from gaining weight. Up your
>> calories, up your protein, up your calf size.
>
> I used to see other guys with massively developed upper bodies....and
> chicken legs. I dont want to look like that, however I am more
> athletic than muscular.
> Im trying to contro my calory intake - keep to 1600 a day. Why would
> an increase improve my calves?

You need more protein....come blow me and swallow
>>
>> You might also try a reduced weight, say, 200 pounds for 10 sets of
>> 20 reps to shake things up. Pause at the top and do all the other
>> tips and tricks recommended in the bodybuilding mags - toes pointed
>> in, out, backwards, upside-down, etc.
>>
>> Get a pair of those calf shoes that Boyer Coe was selling years ago.
>> I think they might be available on eBay.
>>
>> Best of luck.

Mike
January 8th 08, 09:08 PM
Sid Bonfire wrote:
> On Jan 7, 3:25 pm, "David" > wrote:
>> "Curt" > wrote in message
>>
>> news:a11939a9-5b5f-4c7b-9d62-
>> ... On Jan 7, 1:52 pm,
>> "bob" > wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>> Curt wrote:
>>>> On Jan 6, 4:09 pm, "bob" > wrote:
>>>>> Does anyone have any good tips on how to enlarge calves?
>>>>> I have been doing 300lb calf-presses - 5 sets of 12 reps per
>>>>> session - for 3 years now and it has made no difference to the
>>>>> size of my calves. I still have chicken legs!!! Have to say the
>>>>> muscles are good however the size is pathetic.
>>>>> Any ideas...please! - am frustrated.
>>
>>>> How much has your bodyweight gone up during those three years?
>>
>>>> My calves are, I'm sure, equally qualified for the "chicken legs"
>>>> title, however they have grown simply from gaining weight. Up your
>>>> calories, up your protein, up your calf size.
>>
>>> I used to see other guys with massively developed upper
>>> bodies....and chicken legs. I dont want to look like that, however
>>> I am more athletic than
>>> muscular.
>>> Im trying to contro my calory intake - keep to 1600 a day. Why
>>> would an increase improve my calves?
>>
>> Sixteen hundred calories a day is next to starvation. I was on 1500
>> per day from August to November and it wasn't all that much fun.
>> What's your height and weight currently?
>>
>> Why would an increase improve your calves? Because you'd be able to
>> fuel more intense workouts and also because the increase in
>> bodyweight would - given adequate and intense exercise - result in
>> an increase in size throughout your body and not just at your
>> waistline.
>>
>> Old school bodybuilding author Bradley J. Steiner stated that to gain
>> an inch on a person's biceps or flexed arm measurement that it would
>> be necessary to gain about ten to fifteen pounds of bodyweight. I am
>> assuming that this would translate to calves as well as your upper
>> limbs. Naturally, you'll have to exercise your calves and, again, I'd
>> recommend you shake things up if you haven't already. Stick with the
>> same program for three years without results? I hope not.
>>
>> Curt, that is very good advice.
>> By the way, Ichnat thinks your Harley doesn't really belong to you.
>> That your next door neighbour lets you sit on it and you have your
>> photo taken on a tripod remote snap. I told him I didn't think that
>> was the case and I was, you know, pretty loyal to you as we are
>> friends. So, what;s the deal it is true that you sit on your
>> neighbours Harley?
>>
>>>> You might also try a reduced weight, say, 200 pounds for 10 sets
>>>> of 20 reps to shake things up. Pause at the top and do all the
>>>> other tips and tricks recommended in the bodybuilding mags - toes
>>>> pointed in, out, backwards, upside-down, etc.
>>
>>>> Get a pair of those calf shoes that Boyer Coe was selling years
>>>> ago. I think they might be available on eBay.
>>
>>>> Best of luck.
>>
>> --
>> Curt
>
> Squats and dead lifts make everything grow bigger.

But he needs a bigger dick...how can he make that grow bigger

Mike
January 8th 08, 09:09 PM
Sid Bonfire wrote:
> On Jan 7, 8:26 pm, Curt > wrote:
>> On Jan 7, 4:43 pm, Sid Bonfire > wrote:
>> [...]
>>
>>> Squats and dead lifts make everything grow bigger.
>>
>> That's not what Howard Stern was ranting about during his show on
>> personal trainers!
>>
>> http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=ea950a6625
>>
>> Or something like that.
>>
>> --
>> Curt
>
> Hey Curt, you haven't been lurking over at my other hangout, soloacts?
> We've got an asshole from Australia who claims bodybuilders are "300
> lb bombs with 3" fuses!"

Aussie bodybuilders might be 300lb bombs but their fuses are thicker and
longer....I should know

Me[_3_]
January 8th 08, 09:14 PM
Rob Schuh wrote:
> Steve Freides" > wrote in message
> ...
>> "bob" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> Does anyone have any good tips on how to enlarge calves?
>>> I have been doing 300lb calf-presses - 5 sets of 12 reps per
>>> session - for 3 years now and it has made no difference to the size
>>> of my calves. I still have chicken legs!!! Have to say the muscles
>>> are good however the size is pathetic.
>>> Any ideas...please! - am frustrated.
>>
>> I have heard that this is one of those things that's largely genetic
>> - you need to pick different parents. I have very small calf
>> muscles, and the only thing that ever put any size on them was
>> riding a bicycle a lot using a modern "clipless" pedal system that
>> encourages one to pull up and back on the pedals, requiring the calf
>> muscles as stabilizers. Just my opinion.
>>
>> -S-
>> http://www.kbnj.com
>>
>>
>
> Genetics play a huge role in having good calves, but you have to
> train the **** out of them to find out if you have decent genetics.
> If you saw my calves when I started to train, you would have thought
> I could not have good calves, but after years of beating the **** out
> of them, they eventually were one of my better bodyparts.
>

Thanks - not good news about the genetics but I guess as you say, have to
work them cycling.
What do your calves look like now? My calf muscle is small, but looks
developed, however as i said looks like chicken legs . damn


>
> http://www.hardbopdrums.com/

Me[_3_]
January 8th 08, 09:15 PM
Prisoner at War wrote:
> On Jan 6, 4:09 pm, "bob" > wrote:
>> Does anyone have any good tips on how to enlarge calves?
>> I have been doing 300lb calf-presses - 5 sets of 12 reps per session
>> - for 3 years now and it has made no difference to the size of my
>> calves. I still have chicken legs!!! Have to say the muscles are
>> good however the size is pathetic.
>> Any ideas...please! - am frustrated.
>
> Get reincarnated as an Asian or Samoan islander.
>
I had to respond to this....i cant wait for re-incarnation - i want them
now!!!

> In the here and now, if you've been diligent all these years and you
> ain't getting results, then obviously it's genetics.
>
> Don't be frustrated. If everyone looked a certain way, guess what,
> the topic of the day would be how to look different -- "my calves are
> too big" (seriously, TIME magazine had a story years ago on Japanese
> getting calf surgery so that they can sport elongated calves like
> Euros -- people are ****ing stupid; don't be an idiot; use what God
> gave you).

Me[_3_]
January 8th 08, 09:17 PM
Prisoner at War wrote:
> On Jan 7, 2:01 pm, "bob" > wrote:
>>
>>
>> I want calves like Erik Fankhouser - his are
>> awesome...massive!..Maybe I need his DNA?
>
> Maybe you just need to hire his photographer! Bodybuilding is first
> and foremost about illusion.

I guess there is some illusion involved but now when you see him on
video....he has the most awesome calves - awesome. I guess your calvves are
huge considering your genetics - right?

Me[_3_]
January 8th 08, 09:19 PM
Rob Schuh wrote:
> Manco" > wrote in message
> news:[email protected]
>> bob wrote:
>>> Does anyone have any good tips on how to enlarge calves?
>>> I have been doing 300lb calf-presses - 5 sets of 12 reps per session
>>> - for 3 years now and it has made no difference to the size of my
>>> calves. I still have chicken legs!!! Have to say the muscles are
>>> good however the size is pathetic.
>>> Any ideas...please! - am frustrated.
>>
>> Genetics have much to do with this. Don't beat yourself up for
>> something that might be unattainable.
>>
>
> The guy is not training his calves hard enough. How do you know if
> your genetics are good or bad unless you train them correctly?

Any tips or advice on how to train them hard, other than cycling?
>
> http://www.hardbopdrums.com/

Me[_3_]
January 8th 08, 09:23 PM
Spammers_Should_Be_Shot wrote:
> "Rob Schuh" > wrote in message
> ...
>> Manco" > wrote in message
>> news:[email protected]
>>> bob wrote:
>>>> Does anyone have any good tips on how to enlarge calves?
>>>> I have been doing 300lb calf-presses - 5 sets of 12 reps per
>>>> session - for 3 years now and it has made no difference to the
>>>> size of my calves. I still have chicken legs!!! Have to say the
>>>> muscles are good however the size is pathetic.
>>>> Any ideas...please! - am frustrated.
>>>
>>> Genetics have much to do with this. Don't beat yourself up for
>>> something that might be unattainable.
>>>
>>
>> The guy is not training his calves hard enough. How do you know if
>> your genetics are good or bad unless you train them correctly?
>>
>> --
>> Robert Schuh
>> "Everything that elevates an individual above the herd and
>> intimidates the neighbour is henceforth called evil; and
>> the fair, modest, submissive and conforming mentality,
>> the mediocrity of desires attains moral designations and honors"
>> - Nietzsche
>>
>> http://www.hardbopdrums.com/
>>
>>
>
> I hate to agree with "post your real name you #%@!%*&" Rob but i will.
> Everyone is saying genetics (which is a limiting factor but I doubt
> he's at his limit). He originally stated "300lb calf-presses - 5
> sets of 12 reps per session for 3 years now". If you're not getting
> the results you want you should change something (i.e. diet, reps,
> weight, etc.). Without knowing much about you - I'd suggest 60reps
> is too high. I'd try 3sets of 7-9reps (with higher weight) for a
> month and see what happens. Also, in another post you mention your
> calorie intake, it sounds low for muscles building (but I can't
> confirm that without more info).

My weight is 82kgs (175lbs?), my height is 175cms (5'10"). I am more
athletically built than muscular and do watch my dietary intake, eating
healthily as i have night cholesterol too, so have to watch my diet. I have
to eat high protien and low fat foods for cholesterol reduction. I have
noticed an increase in my biceps therefore I'd assume my intake shold be
sufficient for calve building, but doesnt appear to be case.

Mike
January 8th 08, 09:28 PM
Me wrote:
> Spammers_Should_Be_Shot wrote:
>> "Rob Schuh" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> Manco" > wrote in message
>>> news:[email protected]
>>>> bob wrote:
>>>>> Does anyone have any good tips on how to enlarge calves?
>>>>> I have been doing 300lb calf-presses - 5 sets of 12 reps per
>>>>> session - for 3 years now and it has made no difference to the
>>>>> size of my calves. I still have chicken legs!!! Have to say the
>>>>> muscles are good however the size is pathetic.
>>>>> Any ideas...please! - am frustrated.
>>>>
>>>> Genetics have much to do with this. Don't beat yourself up for
>>>> something that might be unattainable.
>>>>
>>>
>>> The guy is not training his calves hard enough. How do you know if
>>> your genetics are good or bad unless you train them correctly?
>>>
>>> --
>>> Robert Schuh
>>> "Everything that elevates an individual above the herd and
>>> intimidates the neighbour is henceforth called evil; and
>>> the fair, modest, submissive and conforming mentality,
>>> the mediocrity of desires attains moral designations and honors"
>>> - Nietzsche
>>>
>>> http://www.hardbopdrums.com/
>>>
>>>
>>
>> I hate to agree with "post your real name you #%@!%*&" Rob but i
>> will. Everyone is saying genetics (which is a limiting factor but I
>> doubt he's at his limit). He originally stated "300lb calf-presses -
>> 5 sets of 12 reps per session for 3 years now". If you're not
>> getting the results you want you should change something (i.e. diet,
>> reps, weight, etc.). Without knowing much about you - I'd suggest
>> 60reps is too high. I'd try 3sets of 7-9reps (with higher weight)
>> for a month and see what happens. Also, in another post you mention
>> your calorie intake, it sounds low for muscles building (but I can't
>> confirm that without more info).
>
> My weight is 82kgs (175lbs?), my height is 175cms (5'10"). I am more
> athletically built than muscular and do watch my dietary intake,
> eating healthily as i have night cholesterol too, so have to watch my
> diet. I have to eat high protien and low fat foods for cholesterol
> reduction. I have noticed an increase in my biceps therefore I'd
> assume my intake shold be sufficient for calve building, but doesnt
> appear to be case.

HIgh protein intake....good....come blow me and swallow

Prisoner at War
January 8th 08, 09:56 PM
On Jan 8, 4:17 pm, "Me" > wrote:
>
>
> I guess there is some illusion involved but now when you see him on
> video....he has the most awesome calves - awesome. I guess your calvves are
> huge considering your genetics - right?

They are huge considering that I do no calf work at all -- and that's
due to genetics.

My calves measure 17"...for comparison purposes, my biceps are 18" --
and I had to work that from ~16.5" in January 2007!

Prisoner at War
January 8th 08, 09:58 PM
On Jan 8, 4:15 pm, "Me" > wrote:
>
>
> I had to respond to this....i cant wait for re-incarnation - i want them
> now!!!

Well, get them site injections, then...though, really, calves are no
big deal. Bodybuilding is fun, but good grief, why get so crazy over
it....

Tom Anderson
January 8th 08, 11:05 PM
On Wed, 9 Jan 2008, Mike wrote:

> bob wrote:
>> Prisoner at War wrote:
>>> On Jan 7, 1:14 am, "Manco" > wrote:
>>>
>>>> Yeah since when are Euros the standard of beauty anyways? Personally
>>>> I think Japanese women are much more attractive.
>>>
>>> It's pretty sick, but hilarious that those Japs are snipping their
>>> calf tendons in order to elongate their calf muscles while Euros are
>>> wondering why their calf muscles can't bulk up!
>>
>> I want calves like Erik Fankhouser - his are awesome...massive!..Maybe
>> I need his DNA?

Jesus! They're bigger than his head!

http://d1063.files.wordpress.com/2007/05/erikfguest1.jpg
http://img165.imageshack.us/img165/6352/rh9k8659xz7.jpg

> I think you like more than his calves....his bulge, right. Now there is
> some hot DNA

I guess that's what cock push-ups will do for you.

tom

--
Science Never Sleeps

Rob Schuh
January 9th 08, 06:02 AM
"Tom Anderson" > wrote in message
.li...
> On Wed, 9 Jan 2008, Mike wrote:
>
>> bob wrote:
>>> Prisoner at War wrote:
>>>> On Jan 7, 1:14 am, "Manco" > wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Yeah since when are Euros the standard of beauty anyways? Personally
>>>>> I think Japanese women are much more attractive.
>>>>
>>>> It's pretty sick, but hilarious that those Japs are snipping their
>>>> calf tendons in order to elongate their calf muscles while Euros are
>>>> wondering why their calf muscles can't bulk up!
>>>
>>> I want calves like Erik Fankhouser - his are awesome...massive!..Maybe I
>>> need his DNA?
>
> Jesus! They're bigger than his head!
>
> http://d1063.files.wordpress.com/2007/05/erikfguest1.jpg
> http://img165.imageshack.us/img165/6352/rh9k8659xz7.jpg
>
>> I think you like more than his calves....his bulge, right. Now there is
>> some hot DNA
>
> I guess that's what cock push-ups will do for you.
>
> tom
>
> --
> Science Never Sleeps

That guy has a horrible looking build. His legs are far too big for his
overall physique.

--
Robert Schuh
"Everything that elevates an individual above the herd and
intimidates the neighbour is henceforth called evil; and
the fair, modest, submissive and conforming mentality,
the mediocrity of desires attains moral designations and honors"
- Nietzsche

http://www.hardbopdrums.com/

Tom Anderson
January 9th 08, 05:01 PM
On Tue, 8 Jan 2008, Rob Schuh wrote:

> "Tom Anderson" > wrote in message
> .li...
>
>>> bob wrote:
>>>> Prisoner at War wrote:
>>>>> On Jan 7, 1:14 am, "Manco" > wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Yeah since when are Euros the standard of beauty anyways? Personally
>>>>>> I think Japanese women are much more attractive.
>>>>>
>>>>> It's pretty sick, but hilarious that those Japs are snipping their
>>>>> calf tendons in order to elongate their calf muscles while Euros are
>>>>> wondering why their calf muscles can't bulk up!
>>>>
>>>> I want calves like Erik Fankhouser - his are awesome...massive!..Maybe I
>>>> need his DNA?
>>
>> Jesus! They're bigger than his head!
>>
>> http://d1063.files.wordpress.com/2007/05/erikfguest1.jpg
>> http://img165.imageshack.us/img165/6352/rh9k8659xz7.jpg
>
> That guy has a horrible looking build. His legs are far too big for his
> overall physique.

He is pretty unusual-looking for a bodybuilder; but then, bodybuilders are
pretty unusual-looking for human beings. He actually looks less freakish
than someone like Ronnie Coleman to me.

But yeah, those thighs are ludicrous.

tom

--
The square-jawed homunculi of Tommy Hilfiger ads make every day an
existential holocaust. -- Scary Go Round

Prisoner at War
January 9th 08, 06:04 PM
On Jan 8, 4:19 pm, "Me" > wrote:
> Rob Schuh wrote:
> > Manco" > wrote in message
> >news:[email protected]
> >> bob wrote:
> >>> Does anyone have any good tips on how to enlarge calves?
> >>> I have been doing 300lb calf-presses - 5 sets of 12 reps per session
> >>> - for 3 years now and it has made no difference to the size of my
> >>> calves. I still have chicken legs!!! Have to say the muscles are
> >>> good however the size is pathetic.
> >>> Any ideas...please! - am frustrated.
>
> >> Genetics have much to do with this. Don't beat yourself up for
> >> something that might be unattainable.
>
> > The guy is not training his calves hard enough. How do you know if
> > your genetics are good or bad unless you train them correctly?
>
> Any tips or advice on how to train them hard, other than cycling?

Cycling hardly trains the calves, even if you're going up a 6%
hill....

Do donkey calf raises, stuff like that. Eat right (namely, excess of
calories needed, preferably protein, but don't go low-carb, either),
rest properly (that means sleep as well as time between workout
sessions), and be patient.

bob
January 9th 08, 08:31 PM
Tom Anderson wrote:
> On Wed, 9 Jan 2008, Mike wrote:
>
>> bob wrote:
>>> Prisoner at War wrote:
>>>> On Jan 7, 1:14 am, "Manco" > wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Yeah since when are Euros the standard of beauty anyways?
>>>>> Personally I think Japanese women are much more attractive.
>>>>
>>>> It's pretty sick, but hilarious that those Japs are snipping their
>>>> calf tendons in order to elongate their calf muscles while Euros
>>>> are wondering why their calf muscles can't bulk up!
>>>
>>> I want calves like Erik Fankhouser - his are
>>> awesome...massive!..Maybe I need his DNA?
>
> Jesus! They're bigger than his head!
>
> http://d1063.files.wordpress.com/2007/05/erikfguest1.jpg
> http://img165.imageshack.us/img165/6352/rh9k8659xz7.jpg


He has an awesome builld...and those calves....i want them :) 10 of mine
together still wont match his size.

>> I think you like more than his calves....his bulge, right. Now there
>> is some hot DNA
>
> I guess that's what cock push-ups will do for you.
>
> tom

bob
January 9th 08, 08:32 PM
Rob Schuh wrote:
> "Tom Anderson" > wrote in message
> .li...
>> On Wed, 9 Jan 2008, Mike wrote:
>>
>>> bob wrote:
>>>> Prisoner at War wrote:
>>>>> On Jan 7, 1:14 am, "Manco" > wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Yeah since when are Euros the standard of beauty anyways?
>>>>>> Personally I think Japanese women are much more attractive.
>>>>>
>>>>> It's pretty sick, but hilarious that those Japs are snipping their
>>>>> calf tendons in order to elongate their calf muscles while Euros
>>>>> are wondering why their calf muscles can't bulk up!
>>>>
>>>> I want calves like Erik Fankhouser - his are
>>>> awesome...massive!..Maybe I need his DNA?
>>
>> Jesus! They're bigger than his head!
>>
>> http://d1063.files.wordpress.com/2007/05/erikfguest1.jpg
>> http://img165.imageshack.us/img165/6352/rh9k8659xz7.jpg
>>
>>> I think you like more than his calves....his bulge, right. Now
>>> there is some hot DNA
>>
>> I guess that's what cock push-ups will do for you.
>>
>> tom
>>
>> --
>> Science Never Sleeps
>
> That guy has a horrible looking build. His legs are far too big for
> his overall physique.

BU then how many contests has he won.....must be regarded as having an
excellent build....after all his hard work

>
> http://www.hardbopdrums.com/

bob
January 9th 08, 08:37 PM
Prisoner at War wrote:
> On Jan 8, 4:15 pm, "Me" > wrote:
>>
>>
>> I had to respond to this....i cant wait for re-incarnation - i want
>> them now!!!
>
> Well, get them site injections, then...though, really, calves are no
> big deal. Bodybuilding is fun, but good grief, why get so crazy over
> it....

I agree with you somewhat, but then your calves are massive, mine arent.
therefore you dont have an issue, right? Rubbing salt into the wound?..lol

Bodybuilding IS fun, enjoyable and hard work, i get a buzz from it otherwise
i'd not be working out but i certainly dont like the "chicken leg" look - on
anyone, specifically guys who have massive upper bodies and skinny lower
bodies.

bob
January 9th 08, 08:41 PM
Prisoner at War wrote:
> On Jan 8, 4:19 pm, "Me" > wrote:
>> Rob Schuh wrote:
>>> Manco" > wrote in message
>>> news:[email protected]
>>>> bob wrote:
>>>>> Does anyone have any good tips on how to enlarge calves?
>>>>> I have been doing 300lb calf-presses - 5 sets of 12 reps per
>>>>> session - for 3 years now and it has made no difference to the
>>>>> size of my calves. I still have chicken legs!!! Have to say the
>>>>> muscles are good however the size is pathetic.
>>>>> Any ideas...please! - am frustrated.
>>
>>>> Genetics have much to do with this. Don't beat yourself up for
>>>> something that might be unattainable.
>>
>>> The guy is not training his calves hard enough. How do you know if
>>> your genetics are good or bad unless you train them correctly?
>>
>> Any tips or advice on how to train them hard, other than cycling?
>
> Cycling hardly trains the calves, even if you're going up a 6%
> hill....
>
> Do donkey calf raises, stuff like that. Eat right (namely, excess of
> calories needed, preferably protein, but don't go low-carb, either),
> rest properly (that means sleep as well as time between workout
> sessions), and be patient.

Eating more will have the calories going straight to my belly, thanks, not
to my calves. I have a copy of the Ab Diet which I follow, as much as I can,
but the book makes no reference to building calves. I do sleep well, work
out every 2nd day, do weights before cardio (as recommended). Being patient?
I have been ....3 years with minmal results.... :(
But thanks to everyone who has offered/posted encouragement/tips etc. Except
that asshole Mike

Rob Schuh
January 9th 08, 08:50 PM
"bob" > wrote in message ...
> Rob Schuh wrote:
>> "Tom Anderson" > wrote in message
>> .li...
>>> On Wed, 9 Jan 2008, Mike wrote:
>>>
>>>> bob wrote:
>>>>> Prisoner at War wrote:
>>>>>> On Jan 7, 1:14 am, "Manco" > wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Yeah since when are Euros the standard of beauty anyways?
>>>>>>> Personally I think Japanese women are much more attractive.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It's pretty sick, but hilarious that those Japs are snipping their
>>>>>> calf tendons in order to elongate their calf muscles while Euros
>>>>>> are wondering why their calf muscles can't bulk up!
>>>>>
>>>>> I want calves like Erik Fankhouser - his are
>>>>> awesome...massive!..Maybe I need his DNA?
>>>
>>> Jesus! They're bigger than his head!
>>>
>>> http://d1063.files.wordpress.com/2007/05/erikfguest1.jpg
>>> http://img165.imageshack.us/img165/6352/rh9k8659xz7.jpg
>>>
>>>> I think you like more than his calves....his bulge, right. Now
>>>> there is some hot DNA
>>>
>>> I guess that's what cock push-ups will do for you.
>>>
>>> tom
>>>
>>> --
>>> Science Never Sleeps
>>
>> That guy has a horrible looking build. His legs are far too big for
>> his overall physique.
>
> BU then how many contests has he won.....must be regarded as having an
> excellent build....after all his hard work


He still looks horrible.





--
Robert Schuh
"Everything that elevates an individual above the herd and
intimidates the neighbour is henceforth called evil; and
the fair, modest, submissive and conforming mentality,
the mediocrity of desires attains moral designations and honors"
- Nietzsche

http://www.hardbopdrums.com/

Rob Schuh
January 9th 08, 08:50 PM
"bob" > wrote in message ...
> Prisoner at War wrote:
>> On Jan 8, 4:15 pm, "Me" > wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> I had to respond to this....i cant wait for re-incarnation - i want
>>> them now!!!
>>
>> Well, get them site injections, then...though, really, calves are no
>> big deal. Bodybuilding is fun, but good grief, why get so crazy over
>> it....
>
> I agree with you somewhat, but then your calves are massive, mine arent.
> therefore you dont have an issue, right? Rubbing salt into the wound?..lol
>
> Bodybuilding IS fun, enjoyable and hard work, i get a buzz from it
> otherwise i'd not be working out but i certainly dont like the "chicken
> leg" look - on anyone, specifically guys who have massive upper bodies and
> skinny lower bodies.
>

You should ignore this PAW piece of ****. He has no calves and is a fat ass.




--
Robert Schuh
"Everything that elevates an individual above the herd and
intimidates the neighbour is henceforth called evil; and
the fair, modest, submissive and conforming mentality,
the mediocrity of desires attains moral designations and honors"
- Nietzsche

http://www.hardbopdrums.com/

Hobbes
January 9th 08, 09:20 PM
In article >,
"Rob Schuh" > wrote:

> "bob" > wrote in message ...
> > Prisoner at War wrote:
> >> On Jan 8, 4:15 pm, "Me" > wrote:
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> I had to respond to this....i cant wait for re-incarnation - i want
> >>> them now!!!
> >>
> >> Well, get them site injections, then...though, really, calves are no
> >> big deal. Bodybuilding is fun, but good grief, why get so crazy over
> >> it....
> >
> > I agree with you somewhat, but then your calves are massive, mine arent.
> > therefore you dont have an issue, right? Rubbing salt into the wound?..lol
> >
> > Bodybuilding IS fun, enjoyable and hard work, i get a buzz from it
> > otherwise i'd not be working out but i certainly dont like the "chicken
> > leg" look - on anyone, specifically guys who have massive upper bodies and
> > skinny lower bodies.
> >
>
> You should ignore this PAW piece of ****. He has no calves and is a fat ass.

Huh.

I'm ignoring him because he is racist and ignorant. (Is that redundant?)

But, each to their own...

--
Keith

January 9th 08, 09:36 PM
On Jan 9, 3:41 pm, "bob" > wrote:
>
>
> Eating more will have the calories going straight to my belly, thanks, not
> to my calves.

They'll also go to your calves, too -- but, again, depending on your
genetic disposition, they may well go more to your belly than your
calves, yes.

But whatever you do, you need the calories to fuel growth. That's an
actual law of nature or something.

> I have a copy of the Ab Diet which I follow, as much as I can,
> but the book makes no reference to building calves.

???

Of course a regular diet book won't make reference to calves, which
are a bodybuilding thing. But that's just as well: there's really
nothing to be said about growing one particular body part or another.

Again, I'm assuming you're 100% correct in your original claim of
having "done everything" about your calves. It's possible, as many
other folks on this thread suspect, that you're not as on-target in
your calf-work as you might think.

> I do sleep well, work
> out every 2nd day, do weights before cardio (as recommended). Being patient?
> I have been ....3 years with minmal results.... :(
> But thanks to everyone who has offered/posted encouragement/tips etc. Except
> that asshole Mike

Maybe your expectations are widely off the mark...I mean, if
Frankenhauser is truly your goal, you may simply have unrealistic
expectations....

January 9th 08, 09:42 PM
On Jan 9, 3:37 pm, "bob" > wrote:
>
>
> I agree with you somewhat, but then your calves are massive, mine arent.
> therefore you dont have an issue, right? Rubbing salt into the wound?..lol

I don't think my calves are considered "massive" -- they're 17 inches,
which is not bad at all since I do no calf work, but that's nothing in
a competition.

> Bodybuilding IS fun, enjoyable and hard work, i get a buzz from it otherwise
> i'd not be working out but i certainly dont like the "chicken leg" look - on
> anyone, specifically guys who have massive upper bodies and skinny lower
> bodies.

Are you sure it's chicken legs you have??

Frankly, I'm a bit disgusted by the "turkey drumstick" look popular in
bodybuilding...the thighs just look way too meaty, I keep thinking of
a Thanksgiving turkey! No joke, it looks almost gross to me...I am
fascinated in how large and striated they can get on these guys, but
only curious in the sense of looking at a blood car accident....

Anyway, just try to put things in perspective. I have lots of folks
calling me "Clark Kent" when they see me in a suit or "Superman" when
they see me in a tank top, but I would not be anything in a
bodybuilding competition. So what does that mean?

Nothing, nothing at all. So relax about the calves -- or any other
body part. I'm glad you do enjoy working out otherwise...who knows,
maybe with you, it'll take four or five years to get the calves just
right, to your satisfaction.

Keep doing them donkey calf raises and fueling and resting properly.
Genetics aside, you may well get the kind of calves you want with just
a bit more time and effort....

January 9th 08, 09:45 PM
As usual, those who have the least to contribute complain the loudest.

Keep working those keyboards, boys...maybe your grip strength will
improve for more enjoyable porn, LOL....


On Jan 9, 4:20 pm, Hobbes > wrote:
> In article >,
> "Rob Schuh" > wrote:
>
>
>
> > You should ignore this PAW piece of ****. He has no calves and is a fat ass.
>
> Huh.
>
> I'm ignoring him because he is racist and ignorant. (Is that redundant?)
>
> But, each to their own...
>
> --
> Keith

Rob Schuh
January 9th 08, 11:16 PM
"Hobbes" > wrote in message
...
> In article >,
> "Rob Schuh" > wrote:
>
>> "bob" > wrote in message
>> ...
>> > Prisoner at War wrote:
>> >> On Jan 8, 4:15 pm, "Me" > wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> I had to respond to this....i cant wait for re-incarnation - i want
>> >>> them now!!!
>> >>
>> >> Well, get them site injections, then...though, really, calves are no
>> >> big deal. Bodybuilding is fun, but good grief, why get so crazy over
>> >> it....
>> >
>> > I agree with you somewhat, but then your calves are massive, mine
>> > arent.
>> > therefore you dont have an issue, right? Rubbing salt into the
>> > wound?..lol
>> >
>> > Bodybuilding IS fun, enjoyable and hard work, i get a buzz from it
>> > otherwise i'd not be working out but i certainly dont like the "chicken
>> > leg" look - on anyone, specifically guys who have massive upper bodies
>> > and
>> > skinny lower bodies.
>> >
>>
>> You should ignore this PAW piece of ****. He has no calves and is a fat
>> ass.
>
> Huh.
>
> I'm ignoring him because he is racist and ignorant. (Is that redundant?)
>
> But, each to their own...
>
> --
> Keith


He is a racist, but he also is a fatty and his calves are ****. That was
what this thread was about. ;-)


--
Robert Schuh
"Everything that elevates an individual above the herd and
intimidates the neighbour is henceforth called evil; and
the fair, modest, submissive and conforming mentality,
the mediocrity of desires attains moral designations and honors"
- Nietzsche

http://www.hardbopdrums.com/

Lucas Buck
January 10th 08, 12:37 AM
On Wed, 09 Jan 2008 15:20:05 -0600, Hobbes > wrote:

>In article >,
> "Rob Schuh" > wrote:
>
>> "bob" > wrote in message ...
>> > Prisoner at War wrote:
>> >> On Jan 8, 4:15 pm, "Me" > wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> I had to respond to this....i cant wait for re-incarnation - i want
>> >>> them now!!!
>> >>
>> >> Well, get them site injections, then...though, really, calves are no
>> >> big deal. Bodybuilding is fun, but good grief, why get so crazy over
>> >> it....
>> >
>> > I agree with you somewhat, but then your calves are massive, mine arent.
>> > therefore you dont have an issue, right? Rubbing salt into the wound?..lol
>> >
>> > Bodybuilding IS fun, enjoyable and hard work, i get a buzz from it
>> > otherwise i'd not be working out but i certainly dont like the "chicken
>> > leg" look - on anyone, specifically guys who have massive upper bodies and
>> > skinny lower bodies.
>> >
>>
>> You should ignore this PAW piece of ****. He has no calves and is a fat ass.
>
>Huh.
>
>I'm ignoring him because he is racist and ignorant. (Is that redundant?)

It is perfectly possible to be well-informed and racist (not that YOU would have
any clue, you flappy-headed tundra-licking Canajun)

Curt
January 10th 08, 02:02 AM
On Jan 9, 4:42 pm, wrote:

> Anyway, just try to put things in perspective. I have lots of folks
> calling me "Clark Kent" when they see me in a suit or "Superman" when
> they see me in a tank top, but I would not be anything in a
> bodybuilding competition. So what does that mean?

That you're bragging about your physique in a roundabout way?

A guess.

--
Curt

Curt
January 10th 08, 02:13 AM
On Jan 9, 6:16 pm, "Rob Schuh" > wrote:

> <snip> and his calves are ****. That was
> what this thread was about. ;-)

So then, genius, if calves are what this thread was about then how do
you justify calling Erik Fankhouser's physique "horrible looking"?
Yeah, poor guy has nooooo calves whatsoever. Pity.

Duh, Bobby. Duh.

And, hey, let's see, Erik earned his IFBB Pro card while you did what
again? Seventh at Nationals? Was that it or some other contest and
placing? Regardless, did you have ANY hope of eventually earning your
Pro card? You're disrespectful, rude, and oblivious to anyone's
greatness other than, of course, your very own. Pbfft!

--
Curt

Hobbes
January 10th 08, 11:52 AM
In article >,
Lucas Buck > wrote:

> On Wed, 09 Jan 2008 15:20:05 -0600, Hobbes > wrote:
>
> >In article >,
> > "Rob Schuh" > wrote:
> >
> >> "bob" > wrote in message ...
> >> > Prisoner at War wrote:
> >> >> On Jan 8, 4:15 pm, "Me" > wrote:
> >> >>>
> >> >>>
> >> >>> I had to respond to this....i cant wait for re-incarnation - i want
> >> >>> them now!!!
> >> >>
> >> >> Well, get them site injections, then...though, really, calves are no
> >> >> big deal. Bodybuilding is fun, but good grief, why get so crazy over
> >> >> it....
> >> >
> >> > I agree with you somewhat, but then your calves are massive, mine arent.
> >> > therefore you dont have an issue, right? Rubbing salt into the
> >> > wound?..lol
> >> >
> >> > Bodybuilding IS fun, enjoyable and hard work, i get a buzz from it
> >> > otherwise i'd not be working out but i certainly dont like the "chicken
> >> > leg" look - on anyone, specifically guys who have massive upper bodies
> >> > and
> >> > skinny lower bodies.
> >> >
> >>
> >> You should ignore this PAW piece of ****. He has no calves and is a fat
> >> ass.
> >
> >Huh.
> >
> >I'm ignoring him because he is racist and ignorant. (Is that redundant?)
>
> It is perfectly possible to be well-informed and racist (not that YOU would
> have
> any clue, you flappy-headed tundra-licking Canajun)

LOL!

Okay. But this guy is both racist and ignorant.

--
Keith

Prisoner at War
January 10th 08, 04:31 PM
On Jan 9, 3:31 pm, "bob" > wrote:
>
>
> He has an awesome builld...and those calves....i want them :) 10 of mine
> together still wont match his size.

Don't forget that he's on steroids, too.

I forgot to mention that the current issue of "Milo" has a very short
article on page 96 on calf work that you might find interesting. In
addition to the standard seated and standing calf raises, the author
advises an "one-arm swing" and "front calf work"...bet you haven't
tried those!

But, really, it's genetics -- and in the case of pro bodybuilders,
steroids, too.

bob
January 10th 08, 06:16 PM
wrote:
> On Jan 9, 3:41 pm, "bob" > wrote:
>>
>>
>> Eating more will have the calories going straight to my belly,
>> thanks, not to my calves.
>
> They'll also go to your calves, too -- but, again, depending on your
> genetic disposition, they may well go more to your belly than your
> calves, yes.
>
> But whatever you do, you need the calories to fuel growth. That's an
> actual law of nature or something.
>
>> I have a copy of the Ab Diet which I follow, as much as I can,
>> but the book makes no reference to building calves.
>
> ???
>
> Of course a regular diet book won't make reference to calves, which
> are a bodybuilding thing. But that's just as well: there's really
> nothing to be said about growing one particular body part or another.
>
> Again, I'm assuming you're 100% correct in your original claim of
> having "done everything" about your calves. It's possible, as many
> other folks on this thread suspect, that you're not as on-target in
> your calf-work as you might think.

If you have workout tips, or advice, that I may have missed, please let me
know. I am open to all suggestions :)
>
>> I do sleep well, work
>> out every 2nd day, do weights before cardio (as recommended). Being
>> patient? I have been ....3 years with minmal results.... :(
>> But thanks to everyone who has offered/posted encouragement/tips
>> etc. Except that asshole Mike
>
> Maybe your expectations are widely off the mark...I mean, if
> Frankenhauser is truly your goal, you may simply have unrealistic
> expectations....

My goal isnt to have calves like Fanhouser, but to have calves that are in
proportion to my upper body. BUt hey, if I could have calves like him, I'd
be pleased.

bob
January 10th 08, 08:51 PM
Prisoner at War wrote:
> On Jan 9, 3:31 pm, "bob" > wrote:
>>
>>
>> He has an awesome builld...and those calves....i want them :) 10 of
>> mine together still wont match his size.
>
> Don't forget that he's on steroids, too.
>
> I forgot to mention that the current issue of "Milo" has a very short
> article on page 96 on calf work that you might find interesting. In
> addition to the standard seated and standing calf raises, the author
> advises an "one-arm swing" and "front calf work"...bet you haven't
> tried those!

Thanks...have checked the MILO website....will search for the article,
asumming its also online?
Nope...havent tried those mentioned - thanks.

> But, really, it's genetics -- and in the case of pro bodybuilders,
> steroids, too.

Andrzej Rosa
January 10th 08, 09:17 PM
Dnia 2008-01-10 bob napisał(a):
> wrote:
>> On Jan 9, 3:41 pm, "bob" > wrote:
>>
>> ???
>>
>> Of course a regular diet book won't make reference to calves, which
>> are a bodybuilding thing. But that's just as well: there's really
>> nothing to be said about growing one particular body part or another.
>>
>> Again, I'm assuming you're 100% correct in your original claim of
>> having "done everything" about your calves. It's possible, as many
>> other folks on this thread suspect, that you're not as on-target in
>> your calf-work as you might think.
>
> If you have workout tips, or advice, that I may have missed, please let me
> know. I am open to all suggestions :)

Calves are almost impossible to overtrain. Train them first thing every
workout, and you should start seeing progress. Arnold did just that.
He even cut sleeves on all his workout pants, to motivate himself for
"pumping" his calves often.

That's what I read. As it happens, I have relatively good genetics for
calves and almost no interest in classic bodybuilding, so I didn't try
this approach, but arguably Arnold didn't have good genetics and finally
managed to build them.

Calves:
Standing calf raises 10 x 10
Seated calf raises 8 x 15
Oneplegged calf raises (holding dumbells) 6x12

*Six* times a week. Kinda crazy, but a reference point anyway.

--
Andrzej Rosa 1127R

Prisoner at War
January 10th 08, 09:40 PM
On Jan 10, 4:17 pm, Andrzej Rosa > wrote:
>
>
> Calves are almost impossible to overtrain. Train them first thing every
> workout, and you should start seeing progress. Arnold did just that.
> He even cut sleeves on all his workout pants, to motivate himself for
> "pumping" his calves often.

Arnold was on steroids. You simply can't take literally anything
these guys say.

I've also heard that abdominals are impossible to overtrain.
But...aren't all skeletal muscles the same? If you can overtrain the
biceps, why not the calves? There's no such thing as a calf muscle
fiber and a triceps muscle fiber, right?

I used to not believe in overtraining at all, but last January I
finally had to confront that, at least due to advancing middle-age,
overtraining is real after all.

> That's what I read. As it happens, I have relatively good genetics for
> calves

Me too -- 17 inches and I do no (direct) work on them at all. I do
jog, however. I'm Asian, though, with some South Pacific or Malay
stock, possibly...maybe you've got a bit of Mongolian in you? ;-)

> and almost no interest in classic bodybuilding, so I didn't try
> this approach, but arguably Arnold didn't have good genetics and finally
> managed to build them.
>
> Calves:
> Standing calf raises 10 x 10
> Seated calf raises 8 x 15
> Oneplegged calf raises (holding dumbells) 6x12
>
> *Six* times a week. Kinda crazy, but a reference point anyway.

He used to brag about working out twice a day for two hours each.
Heck, that's what I'd done, too, at one point! But no such luck for
me...I don't think my biceps ever got bigger than 19 inches, for
example (the right one is currently 18; the left one has atrophied to
just a little over 17.5 due to that elbow injury, which is, however,
getting better, insofar as I can curl 50-lb. dumbbells again).

I agree with Ellington Darden that the problem isn't getting
bodybuilders (and by extension, weightlifters) to exercise -- the
problem is getting them to rest and *not* exercise so much!

> --
> Andrzej Rosa 1127R

Prisoner at War
January 10th 08, 10:14 PM
On Jan 10, 3:51 pm, "bob" > wrote:
>
>
> Thanks...have checked the MILO website....will search for the article,
> asumming its also online?

Nope -- but Tables of Contents for past issues are online, so you can
order anything that looks interesting.

> Nope...havent tried those mentioned - thanks.

Yeah, it's a really good periodical, rather like a good old-fashioned
newsletter (complete with orthographic mistakes despite the slick
paper heavier than most magazines')...good luck with those calves.
Maybe you want to post some photos of your calves? I'm thinking you
probably have unrealistic goals. Most people complain about their
bodies because they have in mind something they saw in a magazine as a
model or ideal. I would never win a contest in my current state, but
I have so many strangers "giving me props" out of nowhere!

Just the other day a streetsweeper goes up to me and compliments me on
being the hulk. On Monday, I was eating breakfast at McDonald's and
reading Milo magazine and the female manager strikes up a conversation
with me on her way out the door for a smoke! She saw the fat guy in a
kilt on the cover and asked what I was reading, and when I explained,
she said, oh, you don't need to read that, you're already big and
strong, and she gave my arm a squeeze! I have things like this
happening to me all the time, but, as you can see at <http://
newyork.craigslist.org/jsy/rnr/534940505.html>, I won't be winning any
contests right now.

So I think maybe you just have unrealistic expectations of calf
development.

Curt
January 11th 08, 03:01 AM
On Jan 10, 5:14 pm, Prisoner at War > wrote:

> <snip> Most people complain about their
> bodies because they have in mind something they saw in a magazine as a
> model or ideal. I would never win a contest in my current state, but
> I have so many strangers "giving me props" out of nowhere!

And here's the irony. The strangers are all homosexual. Fancy that!
The homophobic racist getting complimented by "strangers."

> Just the other day a streetsweeper

Gay.

> goes up to me and compliments me on
> being the hulk. On Monday, I was eating breakfast at McDonald's and
> reading Milo magazine and the female

Riiiiiight. Female. IMPERSONATOR!

> manager strikes up a conversation
> with me on her way out the door for a smoke! She saw the fat guy in a
> kilt on the cover and asked what I was reading, and when I explained,
> she said, oh, you don't need to read that, you're already big and
> strong, and she gave my arm a squeeze!

Wow! Can I have your autograph?

Seriously, I must commend you on reaching out to the gay community.
Especially after all the nasty things you've said against homosexuals,
PaW.

What caused this change of heart?

--
Curt

Andrzej Rosa
January 11th 08, 07:30 AM
Dnia 2008-01-10 Prisoner at War napisał(a):
> On Jan 10, 4:17 pm, Andrzej Rosa > wrote:
>>
>>
>> Calves are almost impossible to overtrain. Train them first thing every
>> workout, and you should start seeing progress. Arnold did just that.
>> He even cut sleeves on all his workout pants, to motivate himself for
>> "pumping" his calves often.
>
> Arnold was on steroids. You simply can't take literally anything
> these guys say.
>
> I've also heard that abdominals are impossible to overtrain.
> But...aren't all skeletal muscles the same? If you can overtrain the
> biceps, why not the calves?

Well, I doubt one can overtrain any small muscle group. Overtraining is
systemic, not localized, so it doesn't apply to muscle groups but to the
whole organism.

Though it's still possible to train calves too much and injure them by
pushing too far too fast. One may develop tendinitis, for example.

> There's no such thing as a calf muscle
> fiber and a triceps muscle fiber, right?

It seems that calves are built from different muscle fibers types than
biceps. We use them all day long, so they seem to respond better to
volume. What Arnold did may be insane, but it shows the direction.

[...]
--
Andrzej Rosa 1127R

Hobbes
January 11th 08, 02:23 PM
In article >,
Andrzej Rosa > wrote:

> Dnia 2008-01-10 Prisoner at War napisał(a):
> > On Jan 10, 4:17 pm, Andrzej Rosa > wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >> Calves are almost impossible to overtrain. Train them first thing every
> >> workout, and you should start seeing progress. Arnold did just that.
> >> He even cut sleeves on all his workout pants, to motivate himself for
> >> "pumping" his calves often.
> >
> > Arnold was on steroids. You simply can't take literally anything
> > these guys say.
> >
> > I've also heard that abdominals are impossible to overtrain.
> > But...aren't all skeletal muscles the same? If you can overtrain the
> > biceps, why not the calves?
>
> Well, I doubt one can overtrain any small muscle group. Overtraining is
> systemic, not localized, so it doesn't apply to muscle groups but to the
> whole organism.
>
> Though it's still possible to train calves too much and injure them by
> pushing too far too fast. One may develop tendinitis, for example.
>
> > There's no such thing as a calf muscle
> > fiber and a triceps muscle fiber, right?
>
> It seems that calves are built from different muscle fibers types than
> biceps. We use them all day long, so they seem to respond better to
> volume. What Arnold did may be insane, but it shows the direction.

That would be the difference. Specific adaptation to imposed demands.
You are already doing a large volume of work for your calves in the
process of daily life. So to elicit changes you have to impose a greater
demand on them. Doing a few sets as a percentage of the 'density' of
work already being done on them isn't going to do much. Where the
triceps muscles see far less use. So 6-8 sets as a percentage of the
total volume of their use is far greater.

Put another way (and this is crude in terms of physiologoy and ignoring
many other factors) - if you do 5 sets of 10 you are doing 50
contractions. For triceps that may represent and increase in their
workload of 10% per week, compared to how many times they are being
intensely (relatively) contracted in a normal week. For calves it would
probably represent an increase of .1% or less.

--
Keith

Prisoner at War
January 11th 08, 03:07 PM
On Jan 11, 2:30 am, Andrzej Rosa > wrote:
>
>
> Well, I doubt one can overtrain any small muscle group.

But aren't biceps small muscles? Seriously, I've even read pros
dismissing the biceps when speaking of arm size because they're such
small muscles....

> Overtraining is
> systemic, not localized, so it doesn't apply to muscle groups but to the
> whole organism.

Hmmm, interesting point...except I should think that overtrain can
also apply to specific muscles and muscle groups -- which is why many
folks don't train biceps every workout session, even if they do the
every-other-day split....

(BTW, I actually used to train biceps every day and don't recall a
problem, but I don't feel like I could do that now, for various
reasons.)

> Though it's still possible to train calves too much and injure them by
> pushing too far too fast. One may develop tendinitis, for example.

Yes, indeed. So then, in what sense is it not possible to "overtrain"
calves?

> It seems that calves are built from different muscle fibers types than
> biceps. We use them all day long, so they seem to respond better to
> volume. What Arnold did may be insane, but it shows the direction.

Eh???? Really!

Well, I have heard of Type I and Type II muscles (roughly
corresponding to the old slow-twitch/fast-twitch categories) -- and
there are even Type IIa, Type IIb, even a possible Type IIx
"prototype" or "stem cell" kind of muscle fiber....

> --
> Andrzej Rosa 1127R

Sid Bonfire[_2_]
January 11th 08, 06:30 PM
Calves are carrying bodyweight on every step we take. You can't say
that for any other body muscle.

Mike
January 11th 08, 08:59 PM
Mike wrote:
> Me wrote:
>> Spammers_Should_Be_Shot wrote:
>>> "Rob Schuh" > wrote in message
>>> ...
>>>> Manco" > wrote in message
>>>> news:[email protected]
>>>>> bob wrote:
>>>>>> Does anyone have any good tips on how to enlarge calves?
>>>>>> I have been doing 300lb calf-presses - 5 sets of 12 reps per
>>>>>> session - for 3 years now and it has made no difference to the
>>>>>> size of my calves. I still have chicken legs!!! Have to say the
>>>>>> muscles are good however the size is pathetic.
>>>>>> Any ideas...please! - am frustrated.
>>>>>
>>>>> Genetics have much to do with this. Don't beat yourself up for
>>>>> something that might be unattainable.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> The guy is not training his calves hard enough. How do you know if
>>>> your genetics are good or bad unless you train them correctly?
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Robert Schuh
>>>> "Everything that elevates an individual above the herd and
>>>> intimidates the neighbour is henceforth called evil; and
>>>> the fair, modest, submissive and conforming mentality,
>>>> the mediocrity of desires attains moral designations and honors"
>>>> - Nietzsche
>>>>
>>>> http://www.hardbopdrums.com/
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> I hate to agree with "post your real name you #%@!%*&" Rob but i
>>> will. Everyone is saying genetics (which is a limiting factor but I
>>> doubt he's at his limit). He originally stated "300lb calf-presses
>>> - 5 sets of 12 reps per session for 3 years now". If you're not
>>> getting the results you want you should change something (i.e. diet,
>>> reps, weight, etc.). Without knowing much about you - I'd suggest
>>> 60reps is too high. I'd try 3sets of 7-9reps (with higher weight)
>>> for a month and see what happens. Also, in another post you mention
>>> your calorie intake, it sounds low for muscles building (but I can't
>>> confirm that without more info).
>>
>> My weight is 82kgs (175lbs?), my height is 175cms (5'10"). I am more
>> athletically built than muscular and do watch my dietary intake,
>> eating healthily as i have night cholesterol too, so have to watch my
>> diet. I have to eat high protien and low fat foods for cholesterol
>> reduction. I have noticed an increase in my biceps therefore I'd
>> assume my intake shold be sufficient for calve building, but doesnt
>> appear to be case.
>
> HIgh protein intake....good....come blow me and swallow

Seems as if you and PAW are lovers, bob. like to have you guys bottom for me
in a 3some

Andrzej Rosa
January 11th 08, 09:37 PM
Dnia 2008-01-11 Prisoner at War napisał(a):
> On Jan 11, 2:30 am, Andrzej Rosa > wrote:
>
>> Overtraining is
>> systemic, not localized, so it doesn't apply to muscle groups but to the
>> whole organism.
>
> Hmmm, interesting point...except I should think that overtrain can
> also apply to specific muscles and muscle groups -- which is why many
> folks don't train biceps every workout session, even if they do the
> every-other-day split....
>
> (BTW, I actually used to train biceps every day and don't recall a
> problem, but I don't feel like I could do that now, for various
> reasons.)

Assuming that your connective tissue can take it, you could do some
seriously insane volume of training for small muscle groups without
getting overtrained. Your muscles could take it fine without
deteriorating and possibly they would even grow faster, so you wouldn't
exactly overtrain your muscles. With small muscles overuse injuries are
a limiting factor, not muscles.

For the record; overtraining happens when one isn't able to recover from
training stimulus between sessions, so performance goes down. Normally
it happens when your overall training load exceeds your recovery ability.

>> Though it's still possible to train calves too much and injure them by
>> pushing too far too fast. One may develop tendinitis, for example.
>
> Yes, indeed. So then, in what sense is it not possible to "overtrain"
> calves?

Muscles will be able to recover between training sessions and
performance will not go down. Just because your tendons are inflamed
doesn't mean that your soleus is overtrained. ;-)

>> It seems that calves are built from different muscle fibers types than
>> biceps. We use them all day long, so they seem to respond better to
>> volume. What Arnold did may be insane, but it shows the direction.
>
> Eh???? Really!
>
> Well, I have heard of Type I and Type II muscles (roughly
> corresponding to the old slow-twitch/fast-twitch categories) -- and
> there are even Type IIa, Type IIb, even a possible Type IIx
> "prototype" or "stem cell" kind of muscle fiber....

Without going into details (which weren't undebatable last time I
checked) calves differed from the rest of skeletal muscles. One could
argue if they were different due to specific stimulus (lotsa walking) or
due to genetics, but they differed.

--
Andrzej Rosa 1127R

Hobbes
January 11th 08, 09:58 PM
In article >,
Andrzej Rosa > wrote:

> Dnia 2008-01-11 Prisoner at War napisał(a):
> > On Jan 11, 2:30 am, Andrzej Rosa > wrote:
> >
> >> Overtraining is
> >> systemic, not localized, so it doesn't apply to muscle groups but to the
> >> whole organism.
> >
> > Hmmm, interesting point...except I should think that overtrain can
> > also apply to specific muscles and muscle groups -- which is why many
> > folks don't train biceps every workout session, even if they do the
> > every-other-day split....
> >
> > (BTW, I actually used to train biceps every day and don't recall a
> > problem, but I don't feel like I could do that now, for various
> > reasons.)
>
> Assuming that your connective tissue can take it, you could do some
> seriously insane volume of training for small muscle groups without
> getting overtrained. Your muscles could take it fine without
> deteriorating and possibly they would even grow faster, so you wouldn't
> exactly overtrain your muscles. With small muscles overuse injuries are
> a limiting factor, not muscles.
>
> For the record; overtraining happens when one isn't able to recover from
> training stimulus between sessions, so performance goes down. Normally
> it happens when your overall training load exceeds your recovery ability.
>
> >> Though it's still possible to train calves too much and injure them by
> >> pushing too far too fast. One may develop tendinitis, for example.
> >
> > Yes, indeed. So then, in what sense is it not possible to "overtrain"
> > calves?
>
> Muscles will be able to recover between training sessions and
> performance will not go down. Just because your tendons are inflamed
> doesn't mean that your soleus is overtrained. ;-)
>
> >> It seems that calves are built from different muscle fibers types than
> >> biceps. We use them all day long, so they seem to respond better to
> >> volume. What Arnold did may be insane, but it shows the direction.
> >
> > Eh???? Really!
> >
> > Well, I have heard of Type I and Type II muscles (roughly
> > corresponding to the old slow-twitch/fast-twitch categories) -- and
> > there are even Type IIa, Type IIb, even a possible Type IIx
> > "prototype" or "stem cell" kind of muscle fiber....
>
> Without going into details (which weren't undebatable last time I
> checked) calves differed from the rest of skeletal muscles. One could
> argue if they were different due to specific stimulus (lotsa walking) or
> due to genetics, but they differed.

They are also different structurally in terms of pennation, having a
greater degree than most other skeletal muscles.

--
Keith

Curt
January 12th 08, 12:20 AM
On Jan 11, 10:07 am, Prisoner at War >
wrote:
[...]

> <snip> I should think <snip>

Hey, no argument there.

--
Curt

Curt
January 12th 08, 12:21 AM
On Jan 11, 1:30 pm, Sid Bonfire > wrote:
> Calves are carrying bodyweight on every step we take. You can't say
> that for any other body muscle.

Your heart? ;o)

I mean, hey, define "carrying bodyweight," Sid.

--
Curt

Spammers_Should_Be_Shot[_2_]
January 13th 08, 09:06 AM
"Hobbes" > wrote in message
...
> In article >,
> Andrzej Rosa > wrote:
>
> > Dnia 2008-01-10 Prisoner at War napisał(a):
> > > On Jan 10, 4:17 pm, Andrzej Rosa > wrote:
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> Calves are almost impossible to overtrain. Train them first thing
every
> > >> workout, and you should start seeing progress. Arnold did just that.
> > >> He even cut sleeves on all his workout pants, to motivate himself for
> > >> "pumping" his calves often.
> > >
> > > Arnold was on steroids. You simply can't take literally anything
> > > these guys say.
> > >
> > > I've also heard that abdominals are impossible to overtrain.
> > > But...aren't all skeletal muscles the same? If you can overtrain the
> > > biceps, why not the calves?
> >
> > Well, I doubt one can overtrain any small muscle group. Overtraining is
> > systemic, not localized, so it doesn't apply to muscle groups but to the
> > whole organism.
> >
> > Though it's still possible to train calves too much and injure them by
> > pushing too far too fast. One may develop tendinitis, for example.
> >
> > > There's no such thing as a calf muscle
> > > fiber and a triceps muscle fiber, right?
> >
> > It seems that calves are built from different muscle fibers types than
> > biceps. We use them all day long, so they seem to respond better to
> > volume. What Arnold did may be insane, but it shows the direction.
>
> That would be the difference. Specific adaptation to imposed demands.
> You are already doing a large volume of work for your calves in the
> process of daily life. So to elicit changes you have to impose a greater
> demand on them. Doing a few sets as a percentage of the 'density' of
> work already being done on them isn't going to do much. Where the
> triceps muscles see far less use. So 6-8 sets as a percentage of the
> total volume of their use is far greater.
>
> Put another way (and this is crude in terms of physiologoy and ignoring
> many other factors) - if you do 5 sets of 10 you are doing 50
> contractions. For triceps that may represent and increase in their
> workload of 10% per week, compared to how many times they are being
> intensely (relatively) contracted in a normal week. For calves it would
> probably represent an increase of .1% or less.
>
> --
> Keith

OK, I'll run the risk of looking like an idiot (but hopefully improve my
knowledge).....

While your calves get worked all day long, they're just carrying bodyweight.
So doing a high volume (and thus low/moderate weight) workout doesn't make
much sense to me (since the volume their doing is already so high).
Wouldn't a couple of moderate volume sets with VERY high weight "stress" the
muscles differently than normal day-to-day activities and therefore
potentially trigger hypertrophy? Sort of like the difference between
training for strength or endurance versus training for hypertrophy? Someone
please correct my thinking (in terms and 2 syllable words that I can
understand).

Thanks!

Prisoner at War
January 13th 08, 03:05 PM
On Jan 11, 1:30 pm, Sid Bonfire > wrote:
> Calves are carrying bodyweight on every step we take. You can't say
> that for any other body muscle.

Except the abs, which help hold us up, too.

But I take your point. Then again, it's precisely because they do so
much work that maybe they shouldn't be further "burdened"...I was
actually wondering something along these lines while jogging
yesterday: I was wondering how all this jogging -- three times a week
-- might impact my squats and, even, my deadlifts, which I try to do
twice a week (though sometimes they get crowded out and are only done
only once a week).

Prisoner at War
January 13th 08, 03:25 PM
On Jan 11, 4:37 pm, Andrzej Rosa > wrote:
>
>
>
> Assuming that your connective tissue can take it, you could do some
> seriously insane volume of training for small muscle groups without
> getting overtrained.

Well, like I said, I used to train biceps all the time, almost every
session -- but yeah, I've stopped doing that now in fear of developing
any "connective tissue issues."

> Your muscles could take it fine without
> deteriorating and possibly they would even grow faster, so you wouldn't
> exactly overtrain your muscles. With small muscles overuse injuries are
> a limiting factor, not muscles.

Well, that's just what "overtraining" means -- "injuries."

My left elbow got injured last summer, precisely in the midst of
blasting my biceps (on the chin-up)...I've only just now (JAN 2008)
recovered to the point where I'm able to curl 50-lb. dumbbells again
-- only slowly, with a lighter warm-up set first -- with my left
arm...I'm running scared now, pretty much...!

> For the record; overtraining happens when one isn't able to recover from
> training stimulus between sessions, so performance goes down. Normally
> it happens when your overall training load exceeds your recovery ability.

Yes, but isn't injury one of the ways overtraining manifests itself?
(Who cares about feeling tired or, even, irritable -- the only symptom
that I'm really concerned about WRT overtraining is a broken body
part!)

> Muscles will be able to recover between training sessions and
> performance will not go down. Just because your tendons are inflamed
> doesn't mean that your soleus is overtrained. ;-)

Ah, interesting point.

But tendons are much stronger than "regular" muscles, and you'll
overtrain those muscles first before you ever do their tendons....

> Without going into details (which weren't undebatable last time I
> checked) calves differed from the rest of skeletal muscles. One could
> argue if they were different due to specific stimulus (lotsa walking) or
> due to genetics, but they differed.

Well, you certainly do seem to be in the majority opinion, FWIW: the
latest edition of Delavier's illustrated "Strength Training Anatomy"
states that they are "an extremely powerful, tough muscle group that
alone raises the entire weight of the body thousands of times in a day
when we walk. Don't hesitate to work it with heavy weights."

In terms of Bob's original concerns, more specifically, the book also
notes that "some people have an unusual triceps surae that does not
grow larger with training. These people can develop strength only.
Long gastrocnemius and soleus muscles develop easily. Conversely,
short calves resist developing bulk."

My question, then: is there any way to tell whether one has short or
long muscles, by just looking from the outside? Exactly what is the
criterion for muscle length, anyway?

> --
> Andrzej Rosa 1127R

Andrzej Rosa
January 13th 08, 04:07 PM
Dnia 2008-01-13 Prisoner at War napisał(a):
> On Jan 11, 4:37 pm, Andrzej Rosa > wrote:
[...]
>> Your muscles could take it fine without
>> deteriorating and possibly they would even grow faster, so you wouldn't
>> exactly overtrain your muscles. With small muscles overuse injuries are
>> a limiting factor, not muscles.
>
> Well, that's just what "overtraining" means -- "injuries."

Not _just_ that. Overtraining can be much worse.

>> For the record; overtraining happens when one isn't able to recover from
>> training stimulus between sessions, so performance goes down. Normally
>> it happens when your overall training load exceeds your recovery ability.
>
> Yes, but isn't injury one of the ways overtraining manifests itself?
> (Who cares about feeling tired or, even, irritable -- the only symptom
> that I'm really concerned about WRT overtraining is a broken body
> part!)

Sure. Mental breakdown is nothing compared with inflamed tendon which
limits the amount of weight one is able to curl. One needs to have
his priorities straight! ;-)

>> Muscles will be able to recover between training sessions and
>> performance will not go down. Just because your tendons are inflamed
>> doesn't mean that your soleus is overtrained. ;-)
>
> Ah, interesting point.
>
> But tendons are much stronger than "regular" muscles, and you'll
> overtrain those muscles first before you ever do their tendons....

Overtraining is systemic, not localized. You will overtrain *yourself*
before you will be able to abuse most of tendons. Your endocrine system
(hormones) will go bonkers if you exceed your recovery ability for too
long. Higher injury rate is just one of symptoms of overtraining, and
not the worst. Bad mood, bad sleep, feeling feverish especially after a
nap, feeling tired, bad performance, lack of motivation, lack of
feelings and so on.

It can get really bad. Lucky people catch a cold or an injury before it
happens, but some don't. Sven Hannawald (wonderfully talented ski
jumper) ended up in a madhouse.

[...]
--
Andrzej Rosa 1127R

Prisoner at War
January 13th 08, 04:27 PM
On Jan 13, 11:07 am, Andrzej Rosa > wrote:
>
>
> Not _just_ that. Overtraining can be much worse.

What??? What could possibly be worse than an injury????

> Sure. Mental breakdown is nothing compared with inflamed tendon which
> limits the amount of weight one is able to curl. One needs to have
> his priorities straight! ;-)

Mental breakdown???? What! I never heard of that!!

I've heard that serious overtraining can lead to either irritability
or a depression-like passiveness, I've heard that serious overtraining
can result in a vastly decreased sex drive, and I've even heard that
overtraining leads to insomnia (?!), but not to insanity!

> Overtraining is systemic, not localized. You will overtrain *yourself*
> before you will be able to abuse most of tendons.

Sounds like you want be a an alt.usage.english purist about the term!

Well, okay, if that's just what the definition is, okay...but then
what do you call it when you use a muscle so much you wind up hurting
it?

> Your endocrine system
> (hormones) will go bonkers if you exceed your recovery ability for too
> long. Higher injury rate is just one of symptoms of overtraining, and
> not the worst. Bad mood, bad sleep, feeling feverish especially after a
> nap, feeling tired, bad performance, lack of motivation, lack of
> feelings and so on.

Eh??? I go through one or another of those conditions any given week
of the month! I'm sure I ain't overtrained. Getting old, maybe....

I believe in overtraining now. But I'm not sure if I buy everything
about the concept....

> It can get really bad. Lucky people catch a cold or an injury before it
> happens, but some don't. Sven Hannawald (wonderfully talented ski
> jumper) ended up in a madhouse.

But maybe the guy was just nuts to begin with...like Van Gogh -- his
art didn't make him mad, he was mad already, and happened to have
created some interesting art along the way!

So let me ask you: how are you dealing with overtraining or trying to
prevent overtraining these days?

> --
> Andrzej Rosa 1127R

Andrzej Rosa
January 13th 08, 07:56 PM
Dnia 2008-01-13 Prisoner at War napisał(a):
> On Jan 13, 11:07 am, Andrzej Rosa > wrote:
>>
>>
>> Not _just_ that. Overtraining can be much worse.
>
> What??? What could possibly be worse than an injury????

Stupidity.

>> Sure. Mental breakdown is nothing compared with inflamed tendon which
>> limits the amount of weight one is able to curl. One needs to have
>> his priorities straight! ;-)
>
> Mental breakdown???? What! I never heard of that!!

Nervous breakdown? Is it the term I should have used?

[...]
>> Overtraining is systemic, not localized. You will overtrain *yourself*
>> before you will be able to abuse most of tendons.
>
> Sounds like you want be a an alt.usage.english purist about the term!
>
> Well, okay, if that's just what the definition is, okay...but then
> what do you call it when you use a muscle so much you wind up hurting
> it?

I never seen it actually happen. That is apart from an injury. You
either overwork your whole system or injure something small, but
overworking a muscle to the point that it can't recover and starts
deteriorating? Even if it happens to some people, I never seen it.

>> Your endocrine system
>> (hormones) will go bonkers if you exceed your recovery ability for too
>> long. Higher injury rate is just one of symptoms of overtraining, and
>> not the worst. Bad mood, bad sleep, feeling feverish especially after a
>> nap, feeling tired, bad performance, lack of motivation, lack of
>> feelings and so on.
>
> Eh??? I go through one or another of those conditions any given week
> of the month! I'm sure I ain't overtrained. Getting old, maybe....

May be. Your recovery ability goes down with age, so it's easier to
cross the border of overstressing yourself.

[...]
>> It can get really bad. Lucky people catch a cold or an injury before it
>> happens, but some don't. Sven Hannawald (wonderfully talented ski
>> jumper) ended up in a madhouse.
>
> But maybe the guy was just nuts to begin with...like Van Gogh

Maybe. But in the meantime in today's news there was an interview with
our ski jumper who dominated the field for years. He looks bad too, I'm
afraid.

> -- his
> art didn't make him mad, he was mad already, and happened to have
> created some interesting art along the way!
>
> So let me ask you: how are you dealing with overtraining or trying to
> prevent overtraining these days?

Me? I train as much as it helps me feel good, and sometimes not even
that (I'm presently nursing an old injury). Looking good is the most
pathetic thing ever if you feel bad.

--
Andrzej Rosa 1127R

Tom Anderson
January 13th 08, 10:35 PM
On Sun, 13 Jan 2008, Spammers_Should_Be_Shot wrote:

> "Hobbes" > wrote in message
> ...
>> In article >,
>> Andrzej Rosa > wrote:
>>
>>> Dnia 2008-01-10 Prisoner at War napisał(a):
>>>
>>>> There's no such thing as a calf muscle fiber and a triceps muscle
>>>> fiber, right?
>>>
>>> It seems that calves are built from different muscle fibers types than
>>> biceps. We use them all day long, so they seem to respond better to
>>> volume. What Arnold did may be insane, but it shows the direction.
>>
>> That would be the difference. Specific adaptation to imposed demands.
>> You are already doing a large volume of work for your calves in the
>> process of daily life. So to elicit changes you have to impose a
>> greater demand on them. Doing a few sets as a percentage of the
>> 'density' of work already being done on them isn't going to do much.
>> Where the triceps muscles see far less use. So 6-8 sets as a percentage
>> of the total volume of their use is far greater.
>>
>> Put another way (and this is crude in terms of physiologoy and ignoring
>> many other factors) - if you do 5 sets of 10 you are doing 50
>> contractions. For triceps that may represent and increase in their
>> workload of 10% per week, compared to how many times they are being
>> intensely (relatively) contracted in a normal week. For calves it would
>> probably represent an increase of .1% or less.
>
> OK, I'll run the risk of looking like an idiot (but hopefully improve my
> knowledge).....
>
> While your calves get worked all day long, they're just carrying bodyweight.
> So doing a high volume (and thus low/moderate weight) workout doesn't make
> much sense to me (since the volume their doing is already so high).
> Wouldn't a couple of moderate volume sets with VERY high weight "stress" the
> muscles differently than normal day-to-day activities and therefore
> potentially trigger hypertrophy? Sort of like the difference between
> training for strength or endurance versus training for hypertrophy?

Yes.

> Someone please correct my thinking (in terms and 2 syllable words that I
> can understand).

Two syllables? Uh, in that case: correct.

Although bear in mind that the stress on your calves is not just your
weight: it's your mass times the acceleration they're working against,
which is 9.8 metres per square second when you're standing still or slowly
lifting yourself up on tiptoe, but rather more if you're doing something
like jumping. However, you're never going to experience substantial
overloads for an extended period of time without weights.

But look again at what Andrzej wrote: if he's right that calves have a
different composition to other muscles, then overload won't have the
effect on them that it does on other muscles. Instead, perhaps you do need
a more high-rep approach. I'm not sure i buy his assertion, though: why
calves? Okay, because you use them for walking and standing, unlike your
pecs etc. But you use quads, hams and glutes for those jobs too: why don't
they behave the same way?

tom

--
A, B.B.C., Cham, Creel, Dvandra, Follow, Hat, Interval, Look, Moul, Ow,
Poise, Quemadero, Rob, Ser, Soot, Su, Thru, Unemancipated, Wave

January 13th 08, 11:19 PM
On Jan 6, 3:09 pm, "bob" > wrote:
> Does anyone have any good tips on how to enlarge calves?
> I have been doing 300lb calf-presses - 5 sets of 12 reps per session - for 3
> years now and it has made no difference to the size of my calves. I still
> have chicken legs!!! Have to say the muscles are good however the size is
> pathetic.
> Any ideas...please! - am frustrated.

Assuming you aren't some freekizzoid asian mo'fo'...

Find a tall building.

Go to the top floor.


Walk down.

If you did 16+ floor and your calves aren't vibrating....then do it
agin you limp wristed piece of panty waisted ****.


Or......


DO it again....


And again....


Now it's easier.....so pack some weight......and do it some more....


going down always builds (character) or something.

All other faggots on this misbegotten excuse for a newsgroup are
mistaken because....anyone here with HALF a brain (and that trims it
down to a narrow few) can show (via peer reviewed journals) that
eccentric contractions build size, i.e., mass, over the shortest
timeframe.

Go ahead you racist faggots, prove me wrong via PUBMED.

No, you can't. You're all gay as ****.

Hobbes
January 14th 08, 01:06 AM
In article >,
Tom Anderson > wrote:

> On Sun, 13 Jan 2008, Spammers_Should_Be_Shot wrote:
>
> > "Hobbes" > wrote in message
> > ...
> >> In article >,
> >> Andrzej Rosa > wrote:
> >>
> >>> Dnia 2008-01-10 Prisoner at War napisał(a):
> >>>
> >>>> There's no such thing as a calf muscle fiber and a triceps muscle
> >>>> fiber, right?
> >>>
> >>> It seems that calves are built from different muscle fibers types than
> >>> biceps. We use them all day long, so they seem to respond better to
> >>> volume. What Arnold did may be insane, but it shows the direction.
> >>
> >> That would be the difference. Specific adaptation to imposed demands.
> >> You are already doing a large volume of work for your calves in the
> >> process of daily life. So to elicit changes you have to impose a
> >> greater demand on them. Doing a few sets as a percentage of the
> >> 'density' of work already being done on them isn't going to do much.
> >> Where the triceps muscles see far less use. So 6-8 sets as a percentage
> >> of the total volume of their use is far greater.
> >>
> >> Put another way (and this is crude in terms of physiologoy and ignoring
> >> many other factors) - if you do 5 sets of 10 you are doing 50
> >> contractions. For triceps that may represent and increase in their
> >> workload of 10% per week, compared to how many times they are being
> >> intensely (relatively) contracted in a normal week. For calves it would
> >> probably represent an increase of .1% or less.
> >
> > OK, I'll run the risk of looking like an idiot (but hopefully improve my
> > knowledge).....
> >
> > While your calves get worked all day long, they're just carrying bodyweight.
> > So doing a high volume (and thus low/moderate weight) workout doesn't make
> > much sense to me (since the volume their doing is already so high).
> > Wouldn't a couple of moderate volume sets with VERY high weight "stress" the
> > muscles differently than normal day-to-day activities and therefore
> > potentially trigger hypertrophy? Sort of like the difference between
> > training for strength or endurance versus training for hypertrophy?
>
> Yes.
>
> > Someone please correct my thinking (in terms and 2 syllable words that I
> > can understand).
>
> Two syllables? Uh, in that case: correct.
>
> Although bear in mind that the stress on your calves is not just your
> weight: it's your mass times the acceleration they're working against,
> which is 9.8 metres per square second when you're standing still or slowly
> lifting yourself up on tiptoe, but rather more if you're doing something
> like jumping. However, you're never going to experience substantial
> overloads for an extended period of time without weights.
>
> But look again at what Andrzej wrote: if he's right that calves have a
> different composition to other muscles, then overload won't have the
> effect on them that it does on other muscles. Instead, perhaps you do need
> a more high-rep approach. I'm not sure i buy his assertion, though: why
> calves? Okay, because you use them for walking and standing, unlike your
> pecs etc. But you use quads, hams and glutes for those jobs too: why don't
> they behave the same way?
>
> tom

For one, the physiology of the calves is different than the others. Very
short contractile length due to the pennation. And second, I think they
actually absorb/create a fair amount of force in things like going down
and up stairs. So the argument to stress them you have to get fairly
radical makes some sense.

But also, many people go beyond simply walking. So if you are a runner
or active in other sports they are doing a fair bit of work. I was
reading an analysis in a text today (on ethics, actually and drug use)
where the person being quoted was making the statement success was
60-70% genetics, 20-25% training and 10-15% 'other factors' such as
psychological, supplements, drugs, etc. Now, the actual percentages are
arguable and vary with activities (and also ignore nutrition), but the
point is still that it is multifactoral and complex. Calves are like
that. If you look at the individual factors that are controllable there
are a lot of things at play.

Personally I think you can be intense and also frequent with calves, but
even so genetics are the prime determinant.

--
Keith

Tom Anderson
January 14th 08, 02:52 PM
On Sun, 13 Jan 2008, Hobbes wrote:

> In article >,
> Tom Anderson > wrote:
>
>> On Sun, 13 Jan 2008, Spammers_Should_Be_Shot wrote:
>>
>>> "Hobbes" > wrote in message
>>> ...
>>>> In article >,
>>>> Andrzej Rosa > wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Dnia 2008-01-10 Prisoner at War napisał(a):
>>>>>
>>>>>> There's no such thing as a calf muscle fiber and a triceps muscle
>>>>>> fiber, right?
>>>>>
>>>>> It seems that calves are built from different muscle fibers types than
>>>>> biceps. We use them all day long, so they seem to respond better to
>>>>> volume. What Arnold did may be insane, but it shows the direction.
>>>>
>>>> That would be the difference. Specific adaptation to imposed demands.
>>>> You are already doing a large volume of work for your calves in the
>>>> process of daily life. So to elicit changes you have to impose a
>>>> greater demand on them. Doing a few sets as a percentage of the
>>>> 'density' of work already being done on them isn't going to do much.
>>>> Where the triceps muscles see far less use. So 6-8 sets as a percentage
>>>> of the total volume of their use is far greater.
>>>>
>>>> Put another way (and this is crude in terms of physiologoy and ignoring
>>>> many other factors) - if you do 5 sets of 10 you are doing 50
>>>> contractions. For triceps that may represent and increase in their
>>>> workload of 10% per week, compared to how many times they are being
>>>> intensely (relatively) contracted in a normal week. For calves it would
>>>> probably represent an increase of .1% or less.
>>>
>>> OK, I'll run the risk of looking like an idiot (but hopefully improve my
>>> knowledge).....
>>>
>>> While your calves get worked all day long, they're just carrying bodyweight.
>>> So doing a high volume (and thus low/moderate weight) workout doesn't make
>>> much sense to me (since the volume their doing is already so high).
>>> Wouldn't a couple of moderate volume sets with VERY high weight "stress" the
>>> muscles differently than normal day-to-day activities and therefore
>>> potentially trigger hypertrophy? Sort of like the difference between
>>> training for strength or endurance versus training for hypertrophy?
>>
>> Yes.
>>
>>> Someone please correct my thinking (in terms and 2 syllable words that I
>>> can understand).
>>
>> Two syllables? Uh, in that case: correct.
>>
>> Although bear in mind that the stress on your calves is not just your
>> weight: it's your mass times the acceleration they're working against,
>> which is 9.8 metres per square second when you're standing still or slowly
>> lifting yourself up on tiptoe, but rather more if you're doing something
>> like jumping. However, you're never going to experience substantial
>> overloads for an extended period of time without weights.
>>
>> But look again at what Andrzej wrote: if he's right that calves have a
>> different composition to other muscles, then overload won't have the
>> effect on them that it does on other muscles. Instead, perhaps you do need
>> a more high-rep approach. I'm not sure i buy his assertion, though: why
>> calves? Okay, because you use them for walking and standing, unlike your
>> pecs etc. But you use quads, hams and glutes for those jobs too: why don't
>> they behave the same way?
>
> For one, the physiology of the calves is different than the others. Very
> short contractile length due to the pennation. And second, I think they
> actually absorb/create a fair amount of force in things like going down
> and up stairs. So the argument to stress them you have to get fairly
> radical makes some sense.

Sure. But does that mean the conventional 8-to-12-rep progressive overload
model isn't optimal? Doesn't it mean you just have to lift more?

> But also, many people go beyond simply walking. So if you are a runner
> or active in other sports they are doing a fair bit of work.

True. But doesn't that also apply to the quads etc? And aren't we still
talking about very brief, explosive movements?

> I was reading an analysis in a text today (on ethics, actually and drug
> use) where the person being quoted was making the statement success was
> 60-70% genetics, 20-25% training and 10-15% 'other factors' such as
> psychological, supplements, drugs, etc. Now, the actual percentages are
> arguable and vary with activities (and also ignore nutrition), but the
> point is still that it is multifactoral and complex. Calves are like
> that. If you look at the individual factors that are controllable there
> are a lot of things at play.

Well, yeah. That's true of all muscles! Why are calves any different?

tom

--
Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by
stupidity -- Hanlon's Razor

Sid Bonfire[_2_]
January 14th 08, 02:59 PM
I do one legged bodyweight calf raises alternate right and left with
no rest until no more reps can be done. This gives a full burn. And it
works.

Hobbes
January 14th 08, 03:01 PM
In article >,
Tom Anderson > wrote:

> On Sun, 13 Jan 2008, Hobbes wrote:
>
> > In article >,
> > Tom Anderson > wrote:
> >
> >> On Sun, 13 Jan 2008, Spammers_Should_Be_Shot wrote:
> >>
> >>> "Hobbes" > wrote in message
> >>> ...
> >>>> In article >,
> >>>> Andrzej Rosa > wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>> Dnia 2008-01-10 Prisoner at War napisał(a):
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> There's no such thing as a calf muscle fiber and a triceps muscle
> >>>>>> fiber, right?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> It seems that calves are built from different muscle fibers types than
> >>>>> biceps. We use them all day long, so they seem to respond better to
> >>>>> volume. What Arnold did may be insane, but it shows the direction.
> >>>>
> >>>> That would be the difference. Specific adaptation to imposed demands.
> >>>> You are already doing a large volume of work for your calves in the
> >>>> process of daily life. So to elicit changes you have to impose a
> >>>> greater demand on them. Doing a few sets as a percentage of the
> >>>> 'density' of work already being done on them isn't going to do much.
> >>>> Where the triceps muscles see far less use. So 6-8 sets as a percentage
> >>>> of the total volume of their use is far greater.
> >>>>
> >>>> Put another way (and this is crude in terms of physiologoy and ignoring
> >>>> many other factors) - if you do 5 sets of 10 you are doing 50
> >>>> contractions. For triceps that may represent and increase in their
> >>>> workload of 10% per week, compared to how many times they are being
> >>>> intensely (relatively) contracted in a normal week. For calves it would
> >>>> probably represent an increase of .1% or less.
> >>>
> >>> OK, I'll run the risk of looking like an idiot (but hopefully improve my
> >>> knowledge).....
> >>>
> >>> While your calves get worked all day long, they're just carrying
> >>> bodyweight.
> >>> So doing a high volume (and thus low/moderate weight) workout doesn't
> >>> make
> >>> much sense to me (since the volume their doing is already so high).
> >>> Wouldn't a couple of moderate volume sets with VERY high weight "stress"
> >>> the
> >>> muscles differently than normal day-to-day activities and therefore
> >>> potentially trigger hypertrophy? Sort of like the difference between
> >>> training for strength or endurance versus training for hypertrophy?
> >>
> >> Yes.
> >>
> >>> Someone please correct my thinking (in terms and 2 syllable words that I
> >>> can understand).
> >>
> >> Two syllables? Uh, in that case: correct.
> >>
> >> Although bear in mind that the stress on your calves is not just your
> >> weight: it's your mass times the acceleration they're working against,
> >> which is 9.8 metres per square second when you're standing still or slowly
> >> lifting yourself up on tiptoe, but rather more if you're doing something
> >> like jumping. However, you're never going to experience substantial
> >> overloads for an extended period of time without weights.
> >>
> >> But look again at what Andrzej wrote: if he's right that calves have a
> >> different composition to other muscles, then overload won't have the
> >> effect on them that it does on other muscles. Instead, perhaps you do need
> >> a more high-rep approach. I'm not sure i buy his assertion, though: why
> >> calves? Okay, because you use them for walking and standing, unlike your
> >> pecs etc. But you use quads, hams and glutes for those jobs too: why don't
> >> they behave the same way?
> >
> > For one, the physiology of the calves is different than the others. Very
> > short contractile length due to the pennation. And second, I think they
> > actually absorb/create a fair amount of force in things like going down
> > and up stairs. So the argument to stress them you have to get fairly
> > radical makes some sense.
>
> Sure. But does that mean the conventional 8-to-12-rep progressive overload
> model isn't optimal? Doesn't it mean you just have to lift more?

I think you have to d a variety of variations, but obviously you are
talking in the higher ends to get results. Nothing wrong with 8-12 being
your base, though.
>
> > But also, many people go beyond simply walking. So if you are a runner
> > or active in other sports they are doing a fair bit of work.
>
> True. But doesn't that also apply to the quads etc? And aren't we still
> talking about very brief, explosive movements?

No, I don't thtink the quads are near as active in absorbing large
amounts of force. In terms of creation of force - the loads are much
less than what you absorb. But to be honest, this is off the top of my
head. I'd have to see if any studies exist.
>
> > I was reading an analysis in a text today (on ethics, actually and drug
> > use) where the person being quoted was making the statement success was
> > 60-70% genetics, 20-25% training and 10-15% 'other factors' such as
> > psychological, supplements, drugs, etc. Now, the actual percentages are
> > arguable and vary with activities (and also ignore nutrition), but the
> > point is still that it is multifactoral and complex. Calves are like
> > that. If you look at the individual factors that are controllable there
> > are a lot of things at play.
>
> Well, yeah. That's true of all muscles! Why are calves any different?

In terms of genetics - I don' think they are. In terms of how much
loading your put on them in the course of just living - I think they
are. And to me that is why they have the huge amount of pennation. They
are primary shock absorbers. So training has to reflect this and has to
be different.

As for the quads argument - I would say they are also different than the
upper body and if hypertrophy was the goal I would train them
differently than, say, the chest. But also differently than the calves,
as they are more involved in the creation of force.

--
Keith

Prisoner at War
January 14th 08, 04:33 PM
On Jan 13, 2:56 pm, Andrzej Rosa > wrote:
>
>
> Stupidity.

And "overtraining" makes you "stupid"?

> Nervous breakdown? Is it the term I should have used?

So "overtraining" also causes a nervous breakdown, in addition to
"stupidity," eh?

> I never seen it actually happen. That is apart from an injury. You
> either overwork your whole system or injure something small, but
> overworking a muscle to the point that it can't recover and starts
> deteriorating? Even if it happens to some people, I never seen it.

Well, sure, it's not so hard to imagine: blast your biceps every day
and see what happens!

> May be. Your recovery ability goes down with age, so it's easier to
> cross the border of overstressing yourself.

But then in what sense is it "pure" overtraining and in what sense is
it just advancing age?

Part of what makes muscle-building so difficult is that it's hard to
know what one's limits are.

> Maybe. But in the meantime in today's news there was an interview with
> our ski jumper who dominated the field for years. He looks bad too, I'm
> afraid.

Well, if physical training has taught us anything, it's that we are
rarely able to determine which is head and which is tail -- am I
athletic because I exercise, or do I exercise because I'm athletic?
Perhaps mental states are like physical states in this regard --
indeed, as something of a materialist I'd say mental states are
nothing more than a very particular instance of physical states!

> Me? I train as much as it helps me feel good, and sometimes not even
> that (I'm presently nursing an old injury). Looking good is the most
> pathetic thing ever if you feel bad.

Well, I guess "experience" is the best antidote against overtraining.

> --
> Andrzej Rosa 1127R

Andrzej Rosa
January 16th 08, 09:19 AM
Dnia 2008-01-13 Tom Anderson napisał(a):
>
> But look again at what Andrzej wrote: if he's right that calves have a
> different composition to other muscles, then overload won't have the
> effect on them that it does on other muscles. Instead, perhaps you do need
> a more high-rep approach. I'm not sure i buy his assertion, though: why
> calves? Okay, because you use them for walking and standing, unlike your
> pecs etc. But you use quads, hams and glutes for those jobs too: why don't
> they behave the same way?

My guess is that they would, if you load them similarly. While you
walk, you lift your bodyweight with one calf and through the range of
motion where leverage isn't all that helpful. When you sit down or get
up you do a partial (through a strong range of motion) and you use both
legs.

Walking upstairs is a bit more challenging, but it involves calves too,
so even if we find an activity where tights are loaded similarly as
calves, we still use our calves. I don't know about you, but best I
could do with one-legged calf raises was (I think) about 40kg, so my
calves are able to lift about 150% of my bodyweight for limited number
of reps and I use them all day long with 100% of my bodyweight. Sitting
down on a chair isn't even remotely close to somebody's max partial
squat, so loads differ substantially. If we did one-legged squats all
day long I bet that developing corresponding muscles further would take
some serious measures.

--
Andrzej Rosa 1127R