PDA

View Full Version : power from exercise


Jim Janney[_2_]
April 26th 11, 07:12 PM
In Portland, stationary bikes are connected to generators.

http://www.deseretnews.com/mobile/article/700130214/At-Oregon-gym-you-burn-calories-move-electrons.html

Reminds me of a Larry Niven novel, the one where they used slave labor
for that. Can't remember the title just now but it was set in a giant
gas cloud.

--
Jim Janney

Existential Angst[_2_]
April 27th 11, 01:31 PM
"Jim Janney" > wrote in message
...
> In Portland, stationary bikes are connected to generators.
>
> http://www.deseretnews.com/mobile/article/700130214/At-Oregon-gym-you-burn-calories-move-electrons.html


I'm in the process of producing one of these bikes. I already work out on a
custom machined prototype -- machined by yours truly, of course. Yeah, I
count steps and kWhrs.... but the kWhrs are just pathetic.

Hmmmm, let's calculate payback of one of these ditties.
You will make or produce on the order of 1c per hour using one of these
bikes as a generator. I'll leave it to the omniscient
I-kin-figger-out-any-goddammthing pyooter programmers here to verify or
dispute this, but dats what it is.

Heh, and the funny part is, there is *no one* on this group who could even
come *close* to collecting that 1c per hour -- you can't believe how
difficult it is to power a single 100 W bulb for any length of time -- I've
managed a few minutes, and I do mean "a few" -- like 2-3.

But let's say you could collect yer shiny penny for an hour's worth of
gut-wrenching labor.
These bikes typically cost well over $1,000, proly closer to $2,000, proly
more in these commercial setups.

Hmmm, lessee, 1c/hour into, say, $1500 is 100,500 hours, or about 11.5
years..... IF the bike were used 24 hours a day!
If the bike were used 10 min a day, like most people would use it, the
payback period would be 1,656 years -- ie, 1.5 milleniums. And dats being
conservative. Proly could double that, in typical usage, for a paltry...
THREE milleniums!!!.

In a health club, you could divide this by what, 10, 20, 30??? For a
breakeven point of 50-450 years -- well in excess of the already-distant 15
year payback cited by dat consultant in the article. Heh, so much for
effing consultants, eh?

And, considering the energy cost to make the bike itself, you'd never break
even on that either, proly not on just smelting the metal for the bike frame
alone, never mind all the other ****.
So in a sense, bike generators are NOT green, but *more* of our problem!!!
Go figger......

If you really wanna be exercise-green, go jogging, barefoot, on some goddamm
grass or on a beach. With some pushups.

The above notwithstanding, if 300 million people were feeding the grid via
bike generators, you'd make an itty-bitty dent in the "energy problem" --
which, btw, is only a "problem" cuz you'n'me are the victims of our fav
domestic terrorists: our effingCongressWhores and their oil pimps.
Generator bikes certainly aren't going to solve DAT problem.

And we didn't get an electric car until "they" found a way to **** us for
$40,000 for a fukn battery and garden-variety electric motor, ie, little
more than an oversized model railroad set -- another story, of course.

But, back to the topic, the article barely alluded to the real value of
watt-generating bikes, in the sentence:
"Jones .... likes seeing her workout quantified in watts."
This is actually perty profound, a thrilling event from a Faraday/Carnot
pov, and can be extraordinarily educational when set up in the right way.

Right now, generator bikes are essentially a jerkoff session for yupsters
with bull**** social/eco consciousness.
If a yupster were to ever pull his dick out of his ass, he could really
learn sumpn sumpn about fitness using these bikes.

Heh, the lady's peak 180 W ackshooly wadn't bad -- no one visiting my li'l
exercise hovel has been able to do that, but then I don't hang around with
too many fit people. Fit people, like vegetarians are, in general,
assholes -- altho there are of course exceptions.

I myself just cranked out 300 W (for mebbe 5 sec), and I believe I've done
350 or so -- which is certainly even higher, as there's about 25 watts of
friction in these set ups, and the generator is proly only about 80%
efficient.

And who knows how accurate the watt indicators on other bikes are. Mine are
very accurate, because, well, they are thermodynamically fundamental
indicators..... of course.

No doubt we'll have another bull**** RealityTV show, The Biggest Watt, along
with the bull**** Biggest Loser, so this **** will peak in typical
fad-style, and then fade away like everything else, except for the bull****
fantasy of ripped abs and fast weight loss thru a pill.
--
EA





>
> Reminds me of a Larry Niven novel, the one where they used slave labor
> for that. Can't remember the title just now but it was set in a giant
> gas cloud.
>
> --
> Jim Janney

Existential Angst[_2_]
April 27th 11, 03:23 PM
"Existential Angst" > wrote in message
...
> "Jim Janney" > wrote in message
> ...
>> In Portland, stationary bikes are connected to generators.
>>
>> http://www.deseretnews.com/mobile/article/700130214/At-Oregon-gym-you-burn-calories-move-electrons.html
>
>
> I'm in the process of producing one of these bikes. I already work out on
> a custom machined prototype -- machined by yours truly, of course. Yeah,
> I count steps and kWhrs.... but the kWhrs are just pathetic.
>
> Hmmmm, let's calculate payback of one of these ditties.
> You will make or produce on the order of 1c per hour using one of these
> bikes as a generator. I'll leave it to the omniscient
> I-kin-figger-out-any-goddammthing pyooter programmers here to verify or
> dispute this, but dats what it is.

Heh, and 1c/hour may be generous.... think bid/ask.
Heh, and you may have to pay TAX on it.... LOL!!!!
--
EA

>
> Heh, and the funny part is, there is *no one* on this group who could even
> come *close* to collecting that 1c per hour -- you can't believe how
> difficult it is to power a single 100 W bulb for any length of time --
> I've managed a few minutes, and I do mean "a few" -- like 2-3.
>
> But let's say you could collect yer shiny penny for an hour's worth of
> gut-wrenching labor.
> These bikes typically cost well over $1,000, proly closer to $2,000, proly
> more in these commercial setups.
>
> Hmmm, lessee, 1c/hour into, say, $1500 is 100,500 hours, or about 11.5
> years..... IF the bike were used 24 hours a day!
> If the bike were used 10 min a day, like most people would use it, the
> payback period would be 1,656 years -- ie, 1.5 milleniums. And dats
> being conservative. Proly could double that, in typical usage, for a
> paltry... THREE milleniums!!!.
>
> In a health club, you could divide this by what, 10, 20, 30??? For a
> breakeven point of 50-450 years -- well in excess of the already-distant
> 15 year payback cited by dat consultant in the article. Heh, so much for
> effing consultants, eh?
>
> And, considering the energy cost to make the bike itself, you'd never
> break even on that either, proly not on just smelting the metal for the
> bike frame alone, never mind all the other ****.
> So in a sense, bike generators are NOT green, but *more* of our problem!!!
> Go figger......
>
> If you really wanna be exercise-green, go jogging, barefoot, on some
> goddamm grass or on a beach. With some pushups.
>
> The above notwithstanding, if 300 million people were feeding the grid via
> bike generators, you'd make an itty-bitty dent in the "energy problem" --
> which, btw, is only a "problem" cuz you'n'me are the victims of our fav
> domestic terrorists: our effingCongressWhores and their oil pimps.
> Generator bikes certainly aren't going to solve DAT problem.
>
> And we didn't get an electric car until "they" found a way to **** us for
> $40,000 for a fukn battery and garden-variety electric motor, ie, little
> more than an oversized model railroad set -- another story, of course.
>
> But, back to the topic, the article barely alluded to the real value of
> watt-generating bikes, in the sentence:
> "Jones .... likes seeing her workout quantified in watts."
> This is actually perty profound, a thrilling event from a Faraday/Carnot
> pov, and can be extraordinarily educational when set up in the right way.
>
> Right now, generator bikes are essentially a jerkoff session for yupsters
> with bull**** social/eco consciousness.
> If a yupster were to ever pull his dick out of his ass, he could really
> learn sumpn sumpn about fitness using these bikes.
>
> Heh, the lady's peak 180 W ackshooly wadn't bad -- no one visiting my li'l
> exercise hovel has been able to do that, but then I don't hang around with
> too many fit people. Fit people, like vegetarians are, in general,
> assholes -- altho there are of course exceptions.
>
> I myself just cranked out 300 W (for mebbe 5 sec), and I believe I've done
> 350 or so -- which is certainly even higher, as there's about 25 watts of
> friction in these set ups, and the generator is proly only about 80%
> efficient.
>
> And who knows how accurate the watt indicators on other bikes are. Mine
> are very accurate, because, well, they are thermodynamically fundamental
> indicators..... of course.
>
> No doubt we'll have another bull**** RealityTV show, The Biggest Watt,
> along with the bull**** Biggest Loser, so this **** will peak in typical
> fad-style, and then fade away like everything else, except for the
> bull**** fantasy of ripped abs and fast weight loss thru a pill.
> --
> EA
>
>
>
>
>
>>
>> Reminds me of a Larry Niven novel, the one where they used slave labor
>> for that. Can't remember the title just now but it was set in a giant
>> gas cloud.
>>
>> --
>> Jim Janney
>
>

Jim Janney[_2_]
April 27th 11, 05:35 PM
"Existential Angst" > writes:

> "Jim Janney" > wrote in message
> ...
>> In Portland, stationary bikes are connected to generators.
>>
>> http://www.deseretnews.com/mobile/article/700130214/At-Oregon-gym-you-burn-calories-move-electrons.html
>
>
> I'm in the process of producing one of these bikes. I already work out on a
> custom machined prototype -- machined by yours truly, of course. Yeah, I
> count steps and kWhrs.... but the kWhrs are just pathetic.
>
> Hmmmm, let's calculate payback of one of these ditties.
> You will make or produce on the order of 1c per hour using one of these
> bikes as a generator. I'll leave it to the omniscient
> I-kin-figger-out-any-goddammthing pyooter programmers here to verify or
> dispute this, but dats what it is.
>
> Heh, and the funny part is, there is *no one* on this group who could even
> come *close* to collecting that 1c per hour -- you can't believe how
> difficult it is to power a single 100 W bulb for any length of time -- I've
> managed a few minutes, and I do mean "a few" -- like 2-3.
>
> But let's say you could collect yer shiny penny for an hour's worth of
> gut-wrenching labor.
> These bikes typically cost well over $1,000, proly closer to $2,000, proly
> more in these commercial setups.
>
> Hmmm, lessee, 1c/hour into, say, $1500 is 100,500 hours, or about 11.5
> years..... IF the bike were used 24 hours a day!
> If the bike were used 10 min a day, like most people would use it, the
> payback period would be 1,656 years -- ie, 1.5 milleniums. And dats being
> conservative. Proly could double that, in typical usage, for a paltry...
> THREE milleniums!!!.
>
> In a health club, you could divide this by what, 10, 20, 30??? For a
> breakeven point of 50-450 years -- well in excess of the already-distant 15
> year payback cited by dat consultant in the article. Heh, so much for
> effing consultants, eh?
>
> And, considering the energy cost to make the bike itself, you'd never break
> even on that either, proly not on just smelting the metal for the bike frame
> alone, never mind all the other ****.
> So in a sense, bike generators are NOT green, but *more* of our problem!!!
> Go figger......
>
> If you really wanna be exercise-green, go jogging, barefoot, on some goddamm
> grass or on a beach. With some pushups.
>
> The above notwithstanding, if 300 million people were feeding the grid via
> bike generators, you'd make an itty-bitty dent in the "energy problem" --
> which, btw, is only a "problem" cuz you'n'me are the victims of our fav
> domestic terrorists: our effingCongressWhores and their oil pimps.
> Generator bikes certainly aren't going to solve DAT problem.
>
> And we didn't get an electric car until "they" found a way to **** us for
> $40,000 for a fukn battery and garden-variety electric motor, ie, little
> more than an oversized model railroad set -- another story, of course.
>
> But, back to the topic, the article barely alluded to the real value of
> watt-generating bikes, in the sentence:
> "Jones .... likes seeing her workout quantified in watts."
> This is actually perty profound, a thrilling event from a Faraday/Carnot
> pov, and can be extraordinarily educational when set up in the right way.
>
> Right now, generator bikes are essentially a jerkoff session for yupsters
> with bull**** social/eco consciousness.
> If a yupster were to ever pull his dick out of his ass, he could really
> learn sumpn sumpn about fitness using these bikes.
>
> Heh, the lady's peak 180 W ackshooly wadn't bad -- no one visiting my li'l
> exercise hovel has been able to do that, but then I don't hang around with
> too many fit people. Fit people, like vegetarians are, in general,
> assholes -- altho there are of course exceptions.
>
> I myself just cranked out 300 W (for mebbe 5 sec), and I believe I've done
> 350 or so -- which is certainly even higher, as there's about 25 watts of
> friction in these set ups, and the generator is proly only about 80%
> efficient.
>
> And who knows how accurate the watt indicators on other bikes are. Mine are
> very accurate, because, well, they are thermodynamically fundamental
> indicators..... of course.
>
> No doubt we'll have another bull**** RealityTV show, The Biggest Watt, along
> with the bull**** Biggest Loser, so this **** will peak in typical
> fad-style, and then fade away like everything else, except for the bull****
> fantasy of ripped abs and fast weight loss thru a pill.

There are definitely limits to how much power anyone can generate. My
favorite example is Bryan Allen, who pedaled a human-powered aircraft
across the English channel. A great stunt, but not something that's
going to find its way into everyday use. For what it's worth, the
Gossamer Albatross needed about 300 watts just to stay in the air, and
the whole flight took a little under three hours. Only an athlete in
training can pull that off.

--
Jim Janney

Existential Angst[_2_]
April 27th 11, 07:33 PM
"Jim Janney" > wrote in message
...
> "Existential Angst" > writes:
>
>> "Jim Janney" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> In Portland, stationary bikes are connected to generators.
>>>
>>> http://www.deseretnews.com/mobile/article/700130214/At-Oregon-gym-you-burn-calories-move-electrons.html
>>
>>
>> I'm in the process of producing one of these bikes. I already work out
>> on a
>> custom machined prototype -- machined by yours truly, of course. Yeah, I
>> count steps and kWhrs.... but the kWhrs are just pathetic.
>>
>> Hmmmm, let's calculate payback of one of these ditties.
>> You will make or produce on the order of 1c per hour using one of these
>> bikes as a generator. I'll leave it to the omniscient
>> I-kin-figger-out-any-goddammthing pyooter programmers here to verify or
>> dispute this, but dats what it is.
>>
>> Heh, and the funny part is, there is *no one* on this group who could
>> even
>> come *close* to collecting that 1c per hour -- you can't believe how
>> difficult it is to power a single 100 W bulb for any length of time --
>> I've
>> managed a few minutes, and I do mean "a few" -- like 2-3.
>>
>> But let's say you could collect yer shiny penny for an hour's worth of
>> gut-wrenching labor.
>> These bikes typically cost well over $1,000, proly closer to $2,000,
>> proly
>> more in these commercial setups.
>>
>> Hmmm, lessee, 1c/hour into, say, $1500 is 100,500 hours, or about 11.5
>> years..... IF the bike were used 24 hours a day!
>> If the bike were used 10 min a day, like most people would use it, the
>> payback period would be 1,656 years -- ie, 1.5 milleniums. And dats
>> being
>> conservative. Proly could double that, in typical usage, for a paltry...
>> THREE milleniums!!!.
>>
>> In a health club, you could divide this by what, 10, 20, 30??? For a
>> breakeven point of 50-450 years -- well in excess of the already-distant
>> 15
>> year payback cited by dat consultant in the article. Heh, so much for
>> effing consultants, eh?
>>
>> And, considering the energy cost to make the bike itself, you'd never
>> break
>> even on that either, proly not on just smelting the metal for the bike
>> frame
>> alone, never mind all the other ****.
>> So in a sense, bike generators are NOT green, but *more* of our
>> problem!!!
>> Go figger......
>>
>> If you really wanna be exercise-green, go jogging, barefoot, on some
>> goddamm
>> grass or on a beach. With some pushups.
>>
>> The above notwithstanding, if 300 million people were feeding the grid
>> via
>> bike generators, you'd make an itty-bitty dent in the "energy problem" --
>> which, btw, is only a "problem" cuz you'n'me are the victims of our fav
>> domestic terrorists: our effingCongressWhores and their oil pimps.
>> Generator bikes certainly aren't going to solve DAT problem.
>>
>> And we didn't get an electric car until "they" found a way to **** us for
>> $40,000 for a fukn battery and garden-variety electric motor, ie, little
>> more than an oversized model railroad set -- another story, of course.
>>
>> But, back to the topic, the article barely alluded to the real value of
>> watt-generating bikes, in the sentence:
>> "Jones .... likes seeing her workout quantified in watts."
>> This is actually perty profound, a thrilling event from a Faraday/Carnot
>> pov, and can be extraordinarily educational when set up in the right way.
>>
>> Right now, generator bikes are essentially a jerkoff session for yupsters
>> with bull**** social/eco consciousness.
>> If a yupster were to ever pull his dick out of his ass, he could really
>> learn sumpn sumpn about fitness using these bikes.
>>
>> Heh, the lady's peak 180 W ackshooly wadn't bad -- no one visiting my
>> li'l
>> exercise hovel has been able to do that, but then I don't hang around
>> with
>> too many fit people. Fit people, like vegetarians are, in general,
>> assholes -- altho there are of course exceptions.
>>
>> I myself just cranked out 300 W (for mebbe 5 sec), and I believe I've
>> done
>> 350 or so -- which is certainly even higher, as there's about 25 watts of
>> friction in these set ups, and the generator is proly only about 80%
>> efficient.
>>
>> And who knows how accurate the watt indicators on other bikes are. Mine
>> are
>> very accurate, because, well, they are thermodynamically fundamental
>> indicators..... of course.
>>
>> No doubt we'll have another bull**** RealityTV show, The Biggest Watt,
>> along
>> with the bull**** Biggest Loser, so this **** will peak in typical
>> fad-style, and then fade away like everything else, except for the
>> bull****
>> fantasy of ripped abs and fast weight loss thru a pill.
>
> There are definitely limits to how much power anyone can generate. My
> favorite example is Bryan Allen, who pedaled a human-powered aircraft
> across the English channel. A great stunt, but not something that's
> going to find its way into everyday use. For what it's worth, the
> Gossamer Albatross needed about 300 watts just to stay in the air, and
> the whole flight took a little under three hours. Only an athlete in
> training can pull that off.

Before green/grid became the rage, generators were not used, but rather some
load cell, from which P = F x velocity was calc'd. Don't know how ackerit
those were, but I've read about cyclists hitting the 2,000 W mark -- I'll
believe it when I see it, cuz if I put 2,000 W worth of electrical load on
my bike, the goddamm generator would burn out -- assuming I could even turn
the pedals.

These units themselves were pretty pricey -- $1200 according to a cyclist I
knew.

With a generator and accurately measured loads, altho you still don't know
exactly what your output is, you know that it is AT LEAST what the face
value of the load is, because of losses, etc.

Ten watts or so is about equal to 1 cal/min of energy expenditure. The
exact thermal value is 1 cal/min = 70 W, but when being converted mechanical
work, you have to use Carnot efficiencies which are about 15-20% -- heh,
mebbe less. So my little 300-400 watt excursions represent VERY high cal
burns, albeit for very short durations.

Using my flagship apparatus, I believe I can about double this, and approach
100 cal/min momentarily -- which leaves you twitching like a bug after being
sprayed..... holy ****....
But then, this is acomplished with very large whole body movements, as
opposed to legs-only on a bike, which are also a kind of hobbled
biomechanics, imo.

Marathon runners sustain about 20 cal/min for long periods, or 200+ W, which
is extraordinary.
I doubt if I could keep up 50 W on a bike, for any long duration.

The 300 W over 3 hrs of that aircraft is beyond extraordinary, and thus a
little hard to believe, as marathoners, at 200 W totally deplete their
glycogen at 2 hours. Heh, mebbe the guy had a tailwind.....

Which, for all you fat burning assholes out there, shows how ineffective fat
burning is for supplying any real energy. When the glycogen depletes, you
deplete.
--
EA


>
> --
> Jim Janney

Jason Earl[_2_]
April 27th 11, 08:22 PM
On Tue, Apr 26 2011, Jim Janney wrote:

> In Portland, stationary bikes are connected to generators.
>
> http://www.deseretnews.com/mobile/article/700130214/At-Oregon-gym-you-burn-calories-move-electrons.html
>
> Reminds me of a Larry Niven novel, the one where they used slave labor
> for that. Can't remember the title just now but it was set in a giant
> gas cloud.

It would probably be more cost effective just to burn people for power.
On the other hand, I have no problems with the marketing ploy that makes
people think that treadmills are a viable energy source. I don't work
out at a gym myself, but I can't help but think that I am a fan of gym
owners, especially niche ones like this.

I personally would be way more concerned about whether they had bumper
plates and allowed you to drop lifts than whether or not they harvested
the $0.02 worth of electricity my workout generated, but that's just
me. Other people have different priorities, and I am cool with that.

Jason

Jason Earl[_2_]
April 27th 11, 10:19 PM
On Wed, Apr 27 2011, Existential Angst wrote:

> "Jim Janney" > wrote in message
> ...
>> In Portland, stationary bikes are connected to generators.
>>
>> http://www.deseretnews.com/mobile/article/700130214/At-Oregon-gym-you-burn-calories-move-electrons.html
>
>
> I'm in the process of producing one of these bikes. I already work
> out on a custom machined prototype -- machined by yours truly, of
> course. Yeah, I count steps and kWhrs.... but the kWhrs are just
> pathetic.

That sounds like a cool toy.

> Hmmmm, let's calculate payback of one of these ditties. You will make
> or produce on the order of 1c per hour using one of these bikes as a
> generator.

Really? that much, huh? I would actually have guessed lower. Then
again, my electricity probably costs less than yours does.

> I'll leave it to the omniscient I-kin-figger-out-any-goddammthing
> pyooter programmers here to verify or dispute this, but dats what it
> is.

You know EA, you might want to considering learning a bit of computer
programming yourself. I would bet that you would be good at it. No
fooling. Programming is pretty straightforward.

> Heh, and the funny part is, there is *no one* on this group who could
> even come *close* to collecting that 1c per hour -- you can't believe
> how difficult it is to power a single 100 W bulb for any length of
> time -- I've managed a few minutes, and I do mean "a few" -- like 2-3.

I will take your word for it.

> But let's say you could collect yer shiny penny for an hour's worth of
> gut-wrenching labor. These bikes typically cost well over $1,000,
> proly closer to $2,000, proly more in these commercial setups.
>
> Hmmm, lessee, 1c/hour into, say, $1500 is 100,500 hours, or about 11.5
> years..... IF the bike were used 24 hours a day! If the bike were
> used 10 min a day, like most people would use it, the payback period
> would be 1,656 years -- ie, 1.5 milleniums. And dats being
> conservative. Proly could double that, in typical usage, for a
> paltry... THREE milleniums!!!.
>
> In a health club, you could divide this by what, 10, 20, 30??? For a
> breakeven point of 50-450 years -- well in excess of the
> already-distant 15 year payback cited by dat consultant in the
> article. Heh, so much for effing consultants, eh?
>
> And, considering the energy cost to make the bike itself, you'd never
> break even on that either, proly not on just smelting the metal for
> the bike frame alone, never mind all the other ****. So in a sense,
> bike generators are NOT green, but *more* of our problem!!! Go
> figger......

That's an excellent recap of the reality of "green" exercise equipment.

I am sure that, at least in the case of this particular owner, the plan
is just a marketing ploy. He would probably be better off to just rig
the machines so that they *looked* like they were generating
electricity. He could even make the lights flicker a bit when someone
was actually peddling. That would almost certainly be less expensive
than fitting exercise equipment to generate electricity. When you take
into consideration the energy used to make the generators that are being
added to the equipment faking it would probably be greener as well.

> If you really wanna be exercise-green, go jogging, barefoot, on some
> goddamm grass or on a beach. With some pushups.

Precisely, the second you are exercising in an air-conditioned space you
are clearly not exercising the "green" way. On the bright side, most
environmentalists don't really want to do stuff that actually helps the
environment. They just want to feel like they are doing more for their
environment than their neighbors.

From a marketing point of view rigging the exercise equipment to
generate electricity is genius, and you have to admit generating
electricity certainly is a workout. There's probably some value in the
extra motivation.

> The above notwithstanding, if 300 million people were feeding the grid
> via bike generators, you'd make an itty-bitty dent in the "energy
> problem" -- which, btw, is only a "problem" cuz you'n'me are the
> victims of our fav domestic terrorists: our effingCongressWhores and
> their oil pimps. Generator bikes certainly aren't going to solve DAT
> problem.

Our energy problems are a bit more complicated than that, but yes, it
certainly makes more sense to start there than with generator bikes.

> And we didn't get an electric car until "they" found a way to **** us
> for $40,000 for a fukn battery and garden-variety electric motor, ie,
> little more than an oversized model railroad set -- another story, of
> course.

It is hard to replace the internal combustion engine. Myself personally
I bought a cheap Chinese scooter to see if that would help, but riding
one of those things around on streets full of full-sized cars is crazy.
So I am back in my Civic.

An electric car actually would make sense for me (assuming I could keep
my mini van for longer trips or for when I need to move the whole
family). However, they don't make sense at the prices offered. Not
even close.

> But, back to the topic, the article barely alluded to the real value
> of watt-generating bikes, in the sentence: "Jones .... likes seeing
> her workout quantified in watts." This is actually perty profound, a
> thrilling event from a Faraday/Carnot pov, and can be extraordinarily
> educational when set up in the right way.

Sure, but you don't really need to hook up a generator for that.
Calculating watts would be good enough for most people. My treadmill
pretends to calculate calories burned, and while I don't trust it, I
can't help but notice it.

> Right now, generator bikes are essentially a jerkoff session for
> yupsters with bull**** social/eco consciousness. If a yupster were to
> ever pull his dick out of his ass, he could really learn sumpn sumpn
> about fitness using these bikes.

It certainly teaches you how much a watt really represents.

> Heh, the lady's peak 180 W ackshooly wadn't bad -- no one visiting my
> li'l exercise hovel has been able to do that, but then I don't hang
> around with too many fit people. Fit people, like vegetarians are, in
> general, assholes -- altho there are of course exceptions.

You should perhaps try being a little less abrasive. I know lots of
people that exercise regularly that are very nice people.

> I myself just cranked out 300 W (for mebbe 5 sec), and I believe I've
> done 350 or so -- which is certainly even higher, as there's about 25
> watts of friction in these set ups, and the generator is proly only
> about 80% efficient.
>
> And who knows how accurate the watt indicators on other bikes are.
> Mine are very accurate, because, well, they are thermodynamically
> fundamental indicators..... of course.

The more complicated the machine the more difficult it is likely to be
to calibrate. I try not to worry about it much. If I care I just
either always use the same machine.

> No doubt we'll have another bull**** RealityTV show, The Biggest Watt,
> along with the bull**** Biggest Loser, so this **** will peak in
> typical fad-style, and then fade away like everything else, except for
> the bull**** fantasy of ripped abs and fast weight loss thru a pill.

My wife loves _The Biggest Loser_, and I have to admit that I find it
quite inspirational at times. Does TBL represent the best or most
practical way to lose weight, not even remotely. However, it does take
people that are ridiculous obese and get them to the point where they
are running a marathon in just a matter of months. At the very least
that gives you a rough estimate of the capabilities of the average
person if they were to devote their life to fitness.

Nice post EA.

Jason

Existential Angst[_2_]
May 2nd 11, 10:13 PM
"build" > wrote in message
...
>
> 'Jim Janney[_2_ Wrote:
>> ;625617']In Portland, stationary bikes are connected to generators.
>>
>> http://tinyurl.com/6xtbrzv
>>
>> Reminds me of a Larry Niven novel, the one where they used slave labor
>> for that. Can't remember the title just now but it was set in a giant
>> gas cloud.
>>
>> --
>> Jim Janney
>
>
> As people become more environmentally conscious, new ways of conserving
> and creating energy are found. Now you can even be green while getting
> your sweat on.

Pay attention and take notes. This is not being green. This is wannabee
greenies jerking themselves off.
--
EA


>
>
>
>
> --
> build

Jim Janney[_2_]
May 3rd 11, 01:12 AM
"Existential Angst" > writes:

> "build" > wrote in message
> ...
>>
>> 'Jim Janney[_2_ Wrote:
>>> ;625617']In Portland, stationary bikes are connected to generators.
>>>
>>> http://tinyurl.com/6xtbrzv
>>>
>>> Reminds me of a Larry Niven novel, the one where they used slave labor
>>> for that. Can't remember the title just now but it was set in a giant
>>> gas cloud.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Jim Janney
>>
>>
>> As people become more environmentally conscious, new ways of conserving
>> and creating energy are found. Now you can even be green while getting
>> your sweat on.
>
> Pay attention and take notes. This is not being green. This is wannabee
> greenies jerking themselves off.

I wouldn't have phrased it just that way, but yes. Riding a bike to the
gym would be useful: hooking a generator to an exercise bike is just a
gimmick. If the gym really wants to be eco-friendly they could install
a bike rack in the parking lot. Of course then people might start
wondering why they need a gym.

(And to answer my own implied question, the book was _The Integral
Trees_).

--
Jim Janney